More Opinions Please!

[thrush]

So, like a couple people before me I would like to hear people's opinions on a couple of games:

  - Neutopia 2
  - Order of the Griffon

  I know both of these games are generally well-thought-of, I have read the review of N2 on the Brother's Duomazov, and I have read a couple more reviews turned up by a web search.  I guess I'd just like to hear some more details from you guys.  Does Neutopia 2 play any different from Neutopia 1?  Is OotG the WRPG of choice on the Turbo?  And if not, what is?

Thanks!

[hizaygizirlz]

I think Neutopia 2 is better than the first one,  I think the enemies and bosses are more interesting, and the world map and dungeons designed a little better.  Plus there are a few more items than the first one.

OotG i think is really good game, It is one of my favorite turbo games.  I think it has good music and the towns and dungeons are fun to explore, there are many different characters to choose from to customize your party.

In my opinion both are great games to own and play if you are into those genres.

[VestCunt]

They're both very good games.

I grew up playing Ultima and scoffing at the Zelda/FF kids, so I'm biased, but I LOVE OotG. 
I wrote a little about it here: 
https://www.pcengine-fx.com/forums/index.php?topic=2337.msg25608#msg25608
If you've played Might and Magic, Ultima, or any other SSI game you'll like it.
The passwords are long and if you don't have backup RAM I might wait.

I've beaten Neutopia 1 and I'm about halfway through Neutopia 2.  It's basically more of the same with a few improvements.

[JoshTurboTrollX]

good classic thread vesty, thanks for the link!

OotG is a great game.  The only improvement that I could see would be the actual creation of characters as apposed to selecting from a bunch of prerolled ones.  Still excellent.  Get this play through it, then if you've got a genesis (EVIL) get D&D Warriors of the Eternal Sun.  Those two games are a great one-two D&D 16-bit goodness punch!

Neutopia II is also really great, better music, grafx, more creative puzzles and about the same controls.  makes me really wish someone would make a homebrew Neutopia III *sniffle*

[jlued686]

N2 is fucking awesome. I remember finishing the first one and waiting not-so-patiently for part 2 to hit. I was not disappointed. I loved (and still love) the hell out of this game. Wonderful production, though not as impressive as Zelda: Link to the Past. It's more like a really refined and bad ass version of the original Zelda. I can't recommend this one enough.

As far as Order of the Griffin goes, everyone here seems to love it, but I haven't played it since I was a kid. I enjoyed it, but didn't really get it at the time. I was perhaps too young. I own it and should probably give it another go, eh?

[thrush]

Thanks a lot for all the responses!  I liked Neutopia 1 a lot when I played through it recently, but so many of the online reviews of 2 that I found were negative; I'm glad I got a second opinion here!  As far as OotG goes, I actually played & enjoyed both the Ultima & Goldbox games as well as the Zelda & Final Fantasy games when I was a youngun; I think just about any style roleplaying works for me.  But, in my 20s I played almost exclusively Japanese games so my knowledge of the western side is pretty slim at this point.

I'll add both to my wishlist, then!

edit:  Thanks for the link, Vestcunt; I'll check that thread out, too.  And I do indeed have a Genesis so I'll have to check out Warriors of the Eternal Sun.  ^^b

[jlued686]

You read negative reviews of Neutopia II? Wow, that's surprising to me. It's one of my favorite HuCards.

[VestCunt]

Yeah, that's weird.  Pretty much the only valid complaint regarding that game is the flame attack knocking enemies in random directions.

[DragonmasterDan]

The only real complaint of Neutopia II I'm aware of is that it's simply Neutopia I with new areas and a few weapon upgrades. It's not of the same scope and scale of Zelda 3 ( also released in 1992) which at the time was a disappointment to people expecting that it would be a legitimate competitor. Neutopia 1 was a lot like Zelda 1, so in 1992 post Zelda 3 (in the US at least) Neutopia II seemed underwhelming.

[jlued686]

Yeah, I can see that. I didn't play Zelda 3 back in the day, so I had no idea what I was missing. But taken on its own merits, N2 was a great deal of fun for me.

[CrackTiger]

The only real complaint of Neutopia II I'm aware of is that it's simply Neutopia I with new areas and a few weapon upgrades. It's not of the same scope and scale of Zelda 3 ( also released in 1992) which at the time was a disappointment to people expecting that it would be a legitimate competitor. Neutopia 1 was a lot like Zelda 1, so in 1992 post Zelda 3 (in the US at least) Neutopia II seemed underwhelming.

For people like me, Zelda 3 was disappointing and both Neutopias were exactly what I wanted.

I especially appreciate the shaded, detailed  and vibrant graphics of the Neutopias which feature lots of real drawn art, while Zelda LttP has bland pale simple-stylized graphics.

[ccovell]

Neutopia II is a good, fun, game, with a nice length to it, and better in many ways to N1 except:

- The music is weaker-sounding.  More PCE/Turbo games around 1989-90 had a very *powerful* audio quality to them, even Hudson games like Super Star Soldier, Bomberman, JJ & Jeff, etc.  Later games (1991-2) had a different composer, sound driver, or something that lacked a lot of punch (N2, Soldier Blade).  Great compositions, just weedy audio.

- The game is worse-programmed.  N2 slows down in many instances: when using your side weapons, when fighting bosses, when 4 enemies are on-screen...  N1 never did that, making the boss fights especially impressive.

- The aforementioned side-weapons problem of sucking your enemies towards you, bringing damage to your character.  Sucks.

[thrush]

The only real complaint of Neutopia II I'm aware of is that it's simply Neutopia I with new areas and a few weapon upgrades.

That sums up all the negatives I'd read.  This could be the poster child for them:
pcengine-fx.com/reviews/duomazov/2009/05/neutopia-ii.html

I, too, really like the graphics in Neutopia 1; there is a certain quality to them that reminds me of other cheery-looking 90s JRPGs (specifically Lagoon and Estopolis/Lufia).  Having said that, I also really like the graphics in Zelda 3 for different reasons.  I think Nintendo is at their best doing abstract, symbolic worlds and their first party franchises (Metroid excluded) kinda lost something when they tried to go more realistic.

Thanks for the heads up on the randomly-bounced enemies & slow-down!

[ccovell]

...the flame attack knocking enemies in random directions.

Thanks for the heads up on the randomly-bounced enemies & slow-down!

It's actually not random.  Whichever direction you're facing when an enemy is hit by your side weapon is the direction enemies will be dragged.  That was probably intentional (and an unavoidable decision for the side weapons that don't have a "direction" but attack from "above" or circle around), but a terrible decision, as when attacking many enemies in several directions, you'll make them slide around the screen.

It would have been a much better and simpler idea to make enemies slide around based on the direction you were facing when you launched the attack, not when enemies were hit by it.  But, whatever, that was 20 years ago and water under the bridge rectifier.

[hizaygizirlz]

Thats why I like threads like these, you get to see other people's point of view and remember little things that you liked or disliked.

The enemies dragging toward you was annoying

[spenoza]

Thats why I like threads like these, you get to see other people's point of view and remember little things that you liked or disliked.

The enemies dragging toward you was annoying

That's why you never turn your back on an enemy before he's started to move from the hit. I remember being careless quite often. Throw off a wand shot and turn around to do something and because I'm facing away when the enemy gets hit by the wand attack he comes flying at my now unguarded behind.

[Arkhan Asylum]

order of the griffon to me is the best US only release.  I wish you could roll your own party, but other than that minor setback, its a perfect AD&D game, worthy of GoldBox status.

Its also the best non computer release of an AD&D game.  It holds true to the original games better than the rest do.

Pool of Derpiance on NES was janky, Eye of the Beholder for SNES had annoying frigging music, and Warriors of the Eternal Sun just wasn't the same!

[spenoza]

order of the griffon to me is the best US only release.  I wish you could roll your own party, but other than that minor setback, its a perfect AD&D game, worthy of GoldBox status.

Its also the best non computer release of an AD&D game.  It holds true to the original games better than the rest do.

Pool of Derpiance on NES was janky, Eye of the Beholder for SNES had annoying frigging music, and Warriors of the Eternal Sun just wasn't the same!

It is the non-PC title which is closest to the Gold Box games in style, but I don't know that I would consider it quite up to the quality of the other Gold Box titles. I suspect it uses a custom engine meant to approximate the original Gold Box engine. Still, it was a nice game, if you could tolerate a few minor quirks.

[Arkhan Asylum]

I think most of its because they wanted it to be a bit accessible to people who were looking for a more quick pickup game.  They probably underestimated the fact that dorks wanted to roll up their characters from scratch, lol.

Its got a more fast pace as far as getting up and going.

[Mathius]

I really need to actually finish Neutopia 1!

Now that I have read these opinions on Neutopia 2 I am going to try to find a good deal on it.

[spenoza]

I think most of its because they wanted it to be a bit accessible to people who were looking for a more quick pickup game.  They probably underestimated the fact that dorks wanted to roll up their characters from scratch, lol.

Its got a more fast pace as far as getting up and going.

I suspect the real reason is that there's no way you could encapsulate that many player-created characters in a password system, and requiring save capabilities for advancement is just not a winning strategy for selling games on the TG.

[VestCunt]

I suspect the real reason is that there's no way you could encapsulate that many player-created characters in a password system, and requiring save capabilities for advancement is just not a winning strategy for selling games on the TG.

Makes sense.  IIRC, Swords and Serpents has some insane password system, where you need a password for your game, plus one for each character, and you also have to remember what you named each character or the passwords don't work.  lol.

[Arkhan Asylum]

Maybe, but I don't think the password system would really have been too brutal, all things considered...

The 5 passwords IN Swords and Serpents aren't really that bad.  Combined, all 5 passwords is about as bad as any NES password.

Better even.  Kid Icarus had that goony font and Upper/Lower.  IIRC, S&S was all uppercase, lol

[spenoza]

Maybe, but I don't think the password system would really have been too brutal, all things considered...

The 5 passwords IN Swords and Serpents aren't really that bad.  Combined, all 5 passwords is about as bad as any NES password.

Better even.  Kid Icarus had that goony font and Upper/Lower.  IIRC, S&S was all uppercase, lol

I'm sure that the S&S passwords did turn off a number of players, however, even if they did make renting the game in bits over time more friendly. I really just wish Hudson/NEC had invested a little energy in designing HuCards with save capabilities. It is stupid that they did not.

[thrush]

Well, I at least am sold on OotG.  The Goldboxes are legendary; even "almost as good" must still be pretty darn good.  I do like it when I can customise a character all kinds, but there is something to be said for working with a limited palette, too.

I think passwords are the only thing from the old days that I don't miss!

I really need to actually finish Neutopia 1!

I support that initiative!