New IC Region Mod Chips!

[override]

Hello All!

I finally finished my layout for the IC Region Mod Im gonna get built....I might have to flip flop it to get it to work Im not positive yet but I sent it to see if they will built!

Let me know whatcha guys think....I think the minimum order is like 3 or 4 so I might give a free sample out to someone who knows how to use it!

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[Cyborc]

nice, is that what i'll be getting? 

[override]

nice, is that what i'll be getting? 

Yes this is what you will be getting....If I can ever get it all done!   

[override]

Hello again!

I finished the design and I am hoping it will work just as good as the previous versions that have been made!

I designed the hu solder points backwards so that the chip can sit directly on top of the hu slot with ease! Your wires can be alot shorter this way and  therefore IMO cause less of a tangle.

I tied the + and - into the switch holes like on the previous boards so that it makes for an easier switch install as well!

I still have no Idea when I will get this design made but if there are any takers Im sure it would help furthur the process since atleast I know someone is interested!


So everyone knows how to read the chip out I can explain a little more into detail. All of the lines are traces except the blue outline, which is the board itself, and the yellow words ofcourse. The yellow words are the silk screen that will be printed on the board! The red traces are on the top layer of the board ( this is a two layer board) and the green lines are on the 2nd layer! Both sides will be masked with green and the silk screen will be in white. The bigger blue circles with red around the blue are soldering holes for your wires to be soldered into, the smaller ones are "via's" which are the points where the trace is broken from the top layer of the board and ran on the bottom layer of the board!

It is possible that a newer version of this board will be released in the future that will be virtually solderless (almost...hehe) and will allow for a quick disconnect and reconnect for troubleshooting systems and doing other mods or repairs etc. Kind of a way to just rid the wires for work and then simply just snap it back in! Also great for reversing the mod to troubleshoot HU issues etc.!

 

/45degreechanges.jpg

Here ya guys go....This is my 45 degree changes done tonight after being told that its more logical to do 45 degree traces instead of 90 degree.....

I got a price quote on both ways tho and the price does not change a bit....For this company to produce 4 of these boards will cost $66.17 shipped.

Thats roughly 15 dollars a peice....About what others were charging for there boards....I figure this is probably an average price range but Im gonna get more quotes! maybe I can find em cheaper....Now I just gotta get Zeons board quoted and see if his is cheaper to reproduce!

Oh and heres and actual size of mine too....good thinking Zeon!!!
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[BlackandBlue]

Looks nice.  What IC are you using, the MC14551B?  Think this will be small enough to squeeze into a TE?

[override]

Looks nice.  What IC are you using, the MC14551B?  Think this will be small enough to squeeze into a TE?

Yeah its a variation of that IC I cant remember the exact number....I designed to board to be 1 in x 1 in so yeah it should be about the same size as grahfs design!

[Zeon]

Updated design 5 I made a mistake with the traces, also some minor rearranging:

Update 6: More rearranging, now smaller and even more space efficient "actual size" should actually read "100% zoom":

Update 7: even more optimizing:

Update 8: Big overhaul, through holes now spaced for 2.54 mm pitch 2 row molex headers, and even smaller:

Update 9: Ever so slightly more compact, changed silkscreening a bit, minor rearrangements. This should be close to the final design, at this point I think it's smaller than grahf's old design. 

Update 10: Just when you think you have it finished, you find some problems. It should all be fixed now, i hope...:

Update 11: Fixed the through hole sizes, minor optimizing:


Bam!:





Smaller size, more efficient use of space, less vias, etc. overall better design, i hope.

[Tatsujin]

generel 45° conducting pathes are more astethic

[override]

Cool Z, Thats not a bad looking PCB....I like mine better hehe!

The silk screen needs to be changed tho...You have it layed out as a trace not a silk screen.

[termis]

Hey, I wouldn't mind keeping one of these IC boards in stock for any future needs, so if you guys need an additional buyer to meet those minimum order numbers, let me know -- I'd definitely be interested.

[blueraven]

If you guys can get the price below $10 id be interested in a few. or more. 

[Zeon]

If you guys can get the price below $10 id be interested in a few. or more. 

Probably not happening without a large order, the 2 ics together are gonna run $2-$3 themselves, unless a better source is found for the surface mount 14551s. This means the pcb is going to have to be $7-8 a piece to get close to that. It may be doable though, it all depends on the quotes we can get.

[override]

If you guys can get the price below $10 id be interested in a few. or more. 

Quoted with my board if we order 9 boards that will bring it down to $9.16 each shipped....If we order 10 it will be $8.64 each shipped. Thats not so bad.

I will go ahead and list a general quantity shipped:

10 - $8.64 each
25 - $5.97 each
50 - $3.74 each
100 - $2.39 each
200 - $1.58 each
500 - $0.87 each
1000 - $0.64 each

[Zeon]

If you guys can get the price below $10 id be interested in a few. or more. 

Quoted with my board if we order 9 boards that will bring it down to $9.16 each shipped....If we order 10 it will be $8.64 each shipped. Thats not so bad.

I will go ahead and list a general quantity shipped:

10 - $8.64 each
25 - $5.97 each
50 - $3.74 each
100 - $2.39 each
200 - $1.58 each
500 - $0.87 each
1000 - $0.64 each

What is the quote for the last design i sent you looking like  ?

[mbrayf]

If these do get made, put me down for 3.... getting the right chips in England is a pain in the arse. 

[override]

What is the quote for the last design i sent you looking like  ?

Well this board dropped the price dramatically!


"Well Johnny what do we for them today?"

These prices will reflect price per board just as shown before, Ill start with the first qty that gets us below $10!

7 - $9.34
10 - $6.77
25 - $5.80
50 - $2.93
100 - $1.89
200 - $1.20
500 - $0.65
1000 - $0.42

[notsonic]

im curious to know why you would use the MC14551B over something a little more simple like a 74x157 which is about half the cost, and digital instead of analog. has the 157 been proven not to work?

[Zeon]

What is the quote for the last design i sent you looking like  ?

Well this board dropped the price dramatically!


"Well Johnny what do we for them today?"

These prices will reflect price per board just as shown before, Ill start with the first qty that gets us below $10!

7 - $9.34
10 - $6.77
25 - $5.80
50 - $2.93
100 - $1.89
200 - $1.20
500 - $0.65
1000 - $0.42

Should be even cheaper now override, check your e-mail. 

[override]

Nah the price stayed the same Zeon...Oh well

Its still pretty cheap tho!

[kattare]

So if we get to 50, we just about get 25 "free"?

That's amazing.  I wouldn't mind buying a bunch and setting them aside to do mods for folks.  Put me down for "25 or whatever it takes to get to 50."

One thing I was thinking about... how hard would it be to add LED leads so you could light up LED A for one switch position and LED B for the other switch position?  I know this could be done on the other half of a 2PDT switch, but might make things a bit cleaner overall?

[override]

So if we get to 50, we just about get 25 "free"?

That's amazing.  I wouldn't mind buying a bunch and setting them aside to do mods for folks.  Put me down for "25 or whatever it takes to get to 50."

One thing I was thinking about... how hard would it be to add LED leads so you could light up LED A for one switch position and LED B for the other switch position?  I know this could be done on the other half of a 2PDT switch, but might make things a bit cleaner overall?

Cool! I'm glad the fact that so many people are interested in these....I would like everyone to keep in mind that depending on what me and Zeon agree upon Im sure we are going to want to make profit off of these lil guys. Depending how we sell them, if we do kits for say noobs maybe like $40 install yourself, $50 we install plus s/h, Selling just the chips with no molex connectors maybe a bout 5 bucks profit, and then with the molex connectors maybe $10 Im not sure to be honest like I said me and Zeon have not really gone over all the details yet.

Im sure the first batch I order will be small and more or less a test batch, with this being said Im sure I will ship some out at wholesale or for the price of shipping/handeling! I deff would like to make sure these lil buggers are gonna be as good as they seem to be turning out as and I will have a system or two to test them out on aswell.

As soon as we get everything finalized I will redo the thread and get it stickied where as then people can just PM me or Zeon for orders!

Thanks for all the support you guys! You all are helping make this happen even if its just one order!

[Game-Tech.US]

im curious to know why you would use the MC14551B over something a little more simple like a 74x157 which is about half the cost, and digital instead of analog. has the 157 been proven not to work?

Got a link to that IC?

[notsonic]

http://www.ee.washington.edu/stores/DataSheets/74ls/74ls157.pdf

its a quad 2-1 mux. its essentially the same as the one the thread is using but its cmos logic instead of analog circuitry i think (or is it ttl.)

[Game-Tech.US]

Hmmm. I didn't see a resistance curve, does that mean there is none being its digital? Also I suppose if our input voltage from the hucard is over .8V then inputs will always be high and its just a matter of hi or low on select? Its starting to click...
I have had no luck getting the 4551 chips to function properly with the TE. I wonder if its added resistance related?
My first attempt I could get JP to work with control high, but no us. I even sourced higher voltage to get lower resistance on the chips, but still no luck. Second attempt I wired them up like this:
http://www.mmmonkey.co.uk/console/pce/region.htm
Now I have nothing but the black screen of death, no hu signal...

[Zeon]

http://www.ee.washington.edu/stores/DataSheets/74ls/74ls157.pdf

its a quad 2-1 mux. its essentially the same as the one the thread is using but its cmos logic instead of analog circuitry i think (or is it ttl.)

I remember looking into it and arriving at the conclusion that the data buses are analog at the place we are working with em, though I am not 100% sure on that.

[Zeon]

Just a little update, we are still looking into getting these made. In the time since we started this pricing on parts/pcbs has changed and the breakdown is as follows:

Pcbs:
4 - $13.80
5 - $11.06
6 - $9.23
7 - $8.22
10 - $5.98
15 - $4.15
20 - $3.34
50 - $2.76
and just for the hell of it: 1000 - $0.40

Amazing in this economic climate prices actually went down. Now for the pricing on the ic's themselves:

http://www.newark.com/on-semiconductor/mc14551bdg/logic-multiplexer-demultiplexer/dp/71J5501

1 - 24           $1.07
25 - 99       $0.9730
100 - 249    $0.9080
250 - 499    $0.8740
500 - 999    $0.8280
1000+          $0.7810

They only have 343 of em left, and I don't think they are going to stock anymore once they sell out. This number has been getting smaller everytime I check that page again. Each region mod pcb needs two of em Also optional will be the molex connector's for easy installation, right now I only have th one picked out, I need to locate a 5 pin header next:

http://www.newark.com/multicomp/mc9a22-1634/wire-to-board-connector/dp/26M1487

1 - 249          $0.418
250 - 499    $0.315
500 - 999    $0.279
1000 - 4999    $0.252
5000+            $0.230

So let's assume we start off with a batch of 20, at the minimum before shipping, that would break down something like this:

Each:
1 pcb = $3.34
2 ics = $1.95
16 pin right angle molex (optional) = $0.42
5 pin right angle molex (optional TBD) = $?.??
Physical switch (optional) = $?.??

$3.34 + $1.95 = $5.27

Total
20 pcbs: $3.34*20 = $66.77
40 ics: $0.9730*40 = $38.92
16 pin right angle molex (optional): $0.418*20 = $8.36
5 pin right angle molex (optional TBD) = $?.?? * 20 = $?.??
Physical switch (optional) = $?.?? * 20 = $?.??

$66.77+ $38.92 = $105.69

Keep in mind this is before shipping charges, and our profit, but if we could get a order of ~15-20 to start with we could sell these things for $15 a pop easily. Unfortunately money is tight for both over and me, so it may be a bit before we can get this started. In the meantime, post in here if you are interested and how many you would like. Maybe we could take preorders or something. The physical size of these babies will be less than the diameter of a quarter on both dimensions without the optional molex connectors so it should fit into any pce hardware easy. We also have a (near or hopefully completely) solderless method of install planned, so stay tuned, and tell all of your friends. 

[override]

Very Nice Zeon! Nice research you have done!   

I have been meaning to come throw a bump up on this post but keep letting it slip my mind, as Zeon says these are still deffinitley going to be made! I am actually thinking of ordering maybe 5 of them and selling em at cost or giving one or two away, for people to try out. We both wanna make sure they work as good as we are saying they will! Patience and Virtua my fellow fans!

Once again Z thanks for this nice update! I didnt even see it coming...lol

[Duo_R]

Be sure to test a tg16 unit hooked up to a CD dock, that is where other versions have failed. I can test on a Turbo Express.

[kattare]

If I can get a test run version prior to "the big batch", I'd likely be willing to buy a bunch.  I do need a working one in hand tho before committing.  ;-)