I Purchased Sapphire!

[CrackTiger]

holding mine in my hands right now!  

Love it, nobody should worry about these hurting the actual collector's market for the authentic one though...in my opinion its obvious these are "alternative" [but I come from a printing background]. VERY PLEASED though. Gonna' look great with my other games. Can't wait to get home and play it!!!! Thanks again!!!!

Well, if they're even close to Ever Anime/Son May(or whatever)/HK soundtracks quality I'll be very happy.

[TurboHuC6280]

Just got mine from the post office.  These are excellent quality.  I'd almost be willing to say that they are originals or pre-production samples...  BUT...

I did some research, and found that they were mastered by a company in Europe called "CARE4DATA", who was recently purchased by ECFgroup/Mediamotion.

http://www.care4data.ch/index2.php
http://www.ecfgroup.nl/domains/default/pages/content.asp?content=12760000000231_0_10000000001651&basicsiteid=27

Apparently, someone near Zurich has been having these things manufactured.  It's certainly intriguing, to say the least.  

My guess is that someone got ahold of the original data.  I'm sure that scanners exist to replicate this stuff pretty well, but someone worked hard to make this as convincing as possible.  The dead giveaway is the CD itself.  It is certainly not mastered in Japan and ring in the center is unique.  I've never seen a PCE game with one.

[pixeljunkie]

VERY interesting. I also noticed the "care4data" on the bottom ring. Almost looked it up too. The stuff is offset printed to be sure...obviously taken from scans of the original given the hit that the print quality takes when compared to an original. So, if these are coming out of Switzerland...then they are different from the Asian bootlegs well documented on the net??? Seems likely these are a new NEW batch then. ???

[TurboHuC6280]

VERY interesting. I also noticed the "care4data" on the bottom ring. Almost looked it up too. The stuff is offset printed to be sure...obviously taken from scans of the original given the hit that the print quality takes when compared to an original. So, if these are coming out of Switzerland...then they are different from the Asian bootlegs well documented on the net??? Seems likely these are a new NEW batch then. ???

Certainly very possible.  We're entering an age were high quality bootlegs are very easy to produce with modern equipment that can be purchased or rented by anyone.  I suspect we'll see a lot more bootleg games in the future, from all sorts of places around the world.

[Fudoh]

Switzerland has a strong PCE community, unfortunately most of them french speaking, so at least ouf of my "range".

I'm not sure if this swiss link above really fits. care4data Benelux on the other hand sure seems like a giant cd/dvd reproduction facilty (care4data.be). Even if produced in Switzerland I've never before seen any being offerend from this side (Switzerland). Distributing them in Japan must have been no. 1 priority - with shops paying up to 30.000 yen for used ones in Tokyo not a bad idea.

I've seen people buying copies all over the years from japanese stores and it's always been either the "very original" or these ones. Also the article on this british videogame site from 2002 (also posted above) refers definitely to these (since I at least know who they got theirs from).

Well, nevertheless, I hope you feel good about these and don't feel ripped off at this pricing !!

[pixeljunkie]

Well, nevertheless, I hope you feel good about these and don't feel ripped off at this pricing !!

Not in the least...VERY PLEASED

thanks again!

[TurboHuC6280]

Switzerland has a strong PCE community, unfortunately most of them french speaking, so at least ouf of my "range".

I'm not sure if this swiss link above really fits. care4data Benelux on the other hand sure seems like a giant cd/dvd reproduction facilty (care4data.be). Even if produced in Switzerland I've never before seen any being offerend from this side (Switzerland). Distributing them in Japan must have been no. 1 priority - with shops paying up to 30.000 yen for used ones in Tokyo not a bad idea.

I've seen people buying copies all over the years from japanese stores and it's always been either the "very original" or these ones. Also the article on this british videogame site from 2002 (also posted above) refers definitely to these (since I at least know who they got theirs from).

Well, nevertheless, I hope you feel good about these and don't feel ripped off at this pricing !!

I'm very pleased with this game.  I think that we all knew perfectly what to expect and it's exceeded my expections.

One of the reasons I purchased it is simply because the mystery behind this version of the game really peaked my couriosity.  Plus, I finally get to use that brand new Arcade Card Pro.

I just played the first few stages of the game, and it's VERY fun.  Reminds me of a blend of Soldier Blade and Lords of Thunder.  In fact, since the music was done by the same group (T's Music, I think) it's almost like hearing "Lords of Thunder Part 2".  

In that sense, it's like a blend of two of the best PCE shooters ever made.

Thanks for the great item and very prompt shipping!

[Paladin]

Now I can't wait to get mine. My Arcade card Duo needs to see some use, and this should fit the bill nicely. I assume they work fine in a Duo since I haven't heard otherwise. Once I get it I'm dropping everything that day to play it, even if I have to call off work to do so.

[pixeljunkie]

so it begins...

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=4315&item=8202768374&rd=1&ssPageName=WDVW

at least its only buy-it-now.

Still waiting for the first jackass to try and pass one off.

[Leroy]

I hope I can get one still.

I emailed Fudoh, if he's out I'll try the new eBay auction.

[Leroy]

Yay! He got back to me and I've got one coming.

Thanks, Fudoh!

[ParanoiaDragon]

Mine came today, but nobody was there to sign for it so.........it looks like I'll have to wait till' tuesday to pick it up

[Paladin]

I've got to pick my copy up at the post office tomorrow. I've been itching to play this for quite some time. I just hope it doesn't let me down; doubt it will though. I've got to brush up my shooter skills for the occassion. I've been playing too many RPGs lately.

On a rather long side note two other games came in as well. One I've played before, but the other I haven't. Anyone have info on the second one, its called Magicoal. I read the discription up for it and I got suckered into buying it. The seller described it as:

"A very cool overhead action/RPG with a heavy puzzle element, much in the spirit of Alundra for the Playstation. Both characters have their own unique abilities neccessary to proceed through the levels. One or two can play, and the computer will control the inactive character in one-player mode."

Right there it scored about 4 points with me in that:
1. Its an Action RPG
2. It has a heavy puzzle element.
3. Like Alundra  
4. Two can play.

Anyway if anyone has played it let me hear an opinion. If it ends up sucking, oh well. It won't be too bad since I didn't spend much on it.

[Keranu]

I have Magicoal and I think it's quite a nice game. You don't really need to know Japanese to play it at all, though it would certainly summon up the story better. However last time I played it, I got stuck on this one part and just could never figure it out, which is where not knowing Japanese is deadly. Other than that, it's a sweet game. It has excellent gameplay with tons of different magics and items (the menus are really unique and loaded with cartoony graphics describing each magic and item), the graphics are very colorful like a SNES (hell I'd say it looks better than some), and the music is superb as well. There is also this other two-player mode you can choose where you get to battle each other or something (really nice music track in the room to choose this option).

From what I've understood in what you posted, I think you will absolutely love the game ;) .

[ParanoiaDragon]

It's a great game, & to me, is more like Secret of Mana, rather then Alundra

[Paladin]

I got all of them yesterday and I must say it was intense. I do indeed enjoy Magicoal, and Sapphire almost made me cry (with pure gaming goodness). I mean this is what games were supposed to be like. Good music, better gameplay, and that little something that makes you always come back for more. Fudoh has my thanks for not charging an arm an a leg for his copies like he could have. I probably would have not picked it up otherwise at least not for a few more years.

Anyway thanks again Fudoh. I'm having a blast with Sapphire. It might not be quite worth the $500 price tag of an original, but its definately worth what I paid for it.

[torgo]

Mine just showed today. I am going nuts waiting to go home and play it. Today may be a long lunch  

[ParanoiaDragon]

Got my copy yesterday as well(not to mention I recieved me Ys Oath in Felghana), needless to say, yesterday was a great day!  Thanks Fudoh!  Everything is perfect, & away, I go to play

[VestCunt]

Thanks Fudoh! just got mine about 1/2 hour ago.  i've had a terrible sour throat for several days so i guess i'm "lucky" in not having to work today.
on sapphire is there anyway to change your ships speed?

[TR0N]

I just got my copy of Sapphire from Fudoh last week.

Thanks to LiquidSnake mentioning it in neo-geo.com

I don't care if it's legit or not pretty much, i wanted a copy to play with. Heck i'm not realy worry about it's value or any thing.

Beside is cheaper then trying to get a copy off,of Ebay and we know how bad that can be.

PS:For collectors who fear it will mess.... up the market you can go to hell for keeping it's value up.

[TR0N]

Finally got a arcade card afther playing it,it's pretty sweet.

Thanks again Fudoh

[pixeljunkie]

keep an eye on this:

<http://cgi.ebay.com/Sapphire-PC-engine-Unopened_W0QQitemZ8210119621QQcategoryZ4315QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem>

I plan on emailing anyone dumb enough to bid on it.

so it begins...

[esteban]

keep an eye on this:

<http://cgi.ebay.com/Sapphire-PC-engine-Unopened_W0QQitemZ8210119621QQcategoryZ4315QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem>

I plan on emailing anyone dumb enough to bid on it.

so it begins...

I totally agree with you.  Also, not to cast suspicion on anyone who visits these boards, but I hope the seller is not "one of us" (even a lurker). But we should definitely warn folks about this. If it weren't for these boards, I know that I wouldn't know about pirated PC Engine games (I've only encountered one obviously pirated game -- a 4-in-1 HuCard).

[GUTS]

Somebody could just check Fudoh's bidder history and see if a guy named Decker45 or whatever has bought from him recently, that would seal it.

[Emerald Rocker]

How can it be factory-sealed but not have a spine card?

Something smells fishy to me.

[OldRover]

Isn't it an amazing coincidence that this shows up shortly after all these copies of Sapphire have now been spread around? Hrm...HRM......!!!

Fishy? A tuna boat just showed up outside my front door...they could smell my screen 500 feet away...

[Yamazaki]

Come on! You think everyone who bougth this intend to playit ;)

nah - there are enough folks out there who would try to make profit!

[TurboHuC6280]

That is totally a fake.  

[jlued686]

Alright guys, I've been following this thread with interest for a while.  I saw this on eBay today:
http://cgi.ebay.com/Turbo-Duo-PC-Engine-SAPPHIRE-Import-Shootem-up_W0QQitemZ8210727874QQcategoryZ4315QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

Should I pick it up?

[CrackTiger]

Alright guys, I've been following this thread with interest for a while.  I saw this on eBay today:
http://cgi.ebay.com/Turbo-Duo-PC-Engine-SAPPHIRE-Import-Shootem-up_W0QQitemZ8210727874QQcategoryZ4315QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

Should I pick it up?

That one's been up almost as long as this thread.

Its the same deal. If you want one of these knock offs at a reasonable price the seller's feedback looks good enough.

[Paladin]

It really depends on what you want to get it for. If your collecting I would look for a real copy. If your looking to just play it then you might want to pick it up. I can vouch for it working a Duo R/RX with an Arcade Card Duo, and I'm pretty sure other systems setups will play it too.

It is an amazing reproduction despite it being obviously that. On the other hand you are paying for pirated merchandise which doesn't sit well with most people for obvious reasons. Anyway its a great game, and if you don't have a problem about shelling out money for a pirated copy then go ahead and get it. It doesn't rape your system like regular CD-Rs are rumored to do, so if your worried about that don't be.

Fudoh was selling them for around the price the auction you listed does. It is likely they got it from him so these people don't seem to be trying to gouge you.

On a side note looky what I found in asian_dvd_classics' history.

http://feedback.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewFeedback&userid=asian_dvd_classics&items=25&page=2&frompage=-1&iid=-1&de=off

Our dear friend decker77 seems to have bought two items from them at about the same time. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out what they were.

[TurboHuC6280]

Our dear friend decker77 seems to have bought two items from them at about the same time. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out what they were.

I wrote Decker77, asking for better images, mentioning that it looked like the bootleg version of the game, and that there was no spine card pictured.

The response:

it's not missing a spine card... i have my personal copy slid back in the shrink wrap and wasn't thinking when i took the pics. i have corrected that in my pictures for the item. I made two closer pics and posted them of the exact item. what do u want to see closer of. i am not sure how to get a pic perfect nd clear without using the flash on my cam. when i do that tho the flash causes a glare off the shrink wrap.

[Paladin]

The CD is by far the easiest thing to look at by itself and determine whether its a fake or not. Ask him to take a picture of the CD itself with his copy. He says he bought them both when it first came out so if his copy is the bootleg we've all come to know he is lying. I believe he bought them at the same time, just that it happened to be this July . I would like to see his reply to requesting a picture of the front of his CD. I'm sure it would be amusing to say the least.

[esteban]

Paladin & zborged: thanks for your efforts! I am certainly interested to see what our friend does.

[jlued686]

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=8210727874&rd=1&sspagename=STRK%3AMEWA%3AIT&rd=1

Looks like the one I was interested in was bought up by an anonymous buyer.  Betcha it shows up at triple the cost soon...

[neokellyzero]

Check this out-

http://cgi.ebay.com/Sapphire-PC-engine-Unopened_W0QQitemZ8210119621QQcategoryZ4315QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

looks like decker "original" now has the spine card-

Amazing how some people will screw over the uninitiated/uninformed-
Almost makes me want to bid, not pay and then leave negative feedback-

[CrackTiger]

My internet's been down for a good week now, so I don't know if this is old news... but it looks like bullseyes_videogames_collectibles is selling a Duo-R + Sapphire for only $525.

It looks like they're now peddling the bootlegs as the real deal.


http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=8194304912&ssPageName=MERC_VI_RSCC_Pr4_PcY_BIN_Stores_IT



"Also Included is the game:

Ginga Fukuei Densetsu Sapphire.  It is very rare to find, especially COMPLETE In Original Case.  Game Disc is in MINT/Brand New like Condition, Instruction Booklet is Mint (Maybe unopened/untouched since these type of games can played without knowing anything), and Case is Excellent condition (some shelf wear and one crack on backside).  Have had a couple questions if the spine card is included, when I got this I did not know that they existed or what they were, and I don't see it here so the answer is no, so Back of the Case says copyright 1995, so it is in gem condition for being that old.  Heck, I still see these selling for over $400 for this game when it actually is listed (hardly ever), so this is a bargain. In order to play this game on the system you must have (OR BUY FROM US) the PC Engine ARCADE CARD DUO we have listed in another auction."

[CrackTiger]

And they've got another boxed Duo-R for $380-

http://cgi.ebay.com/Turbo-PCE-Duo-R-SYSTEM-BRAND-NEW-MINT-IN-BOX-USA-Seller_W0QQitemZ8141326816QQcategoryZ62054QQcmdZViewItem

So they're just throwing in Sapphire for only $145. Who says these guys are ripp offs?

[Keranu]

God damn that Bullseye.

[esteban]

Does anyone else hear get a headache just looking at the manner in which Bullshit uses fonts?  It is absolutely insane and makes it difficult to read, among other things.

PERHAPS that is the intended effect: to discourage folks from reading the text.

[GUTS]

Hah that'd be hilarious if you were right!

[CrackTiger]

What I can't believe is that anyone buys anything at all from him.

Even if he had 100% positive feedback and wasn't selling garbage, all his prices are like double the going rates and he doesn't list anything that actually rare.

[Keranu]

Does anyone else hear get a headache just looking at the manner in which Bullshit uses fonts?  It is absolutely insane and makes it difficult to read, among other things.

PERHAPS that is the intended effect: to discourage folks from reading the text.

Damn, just another reason why Bullseye sucks.

[MotherGunner]

So is there a way to make the ships in sapphire move faster?

[Keranu]

I don't think so because they were trying to balance out each ship/character in the game with some being faster and slower, poweful and weak, etc...

[CrackTiger]

I don't think so because they were trying to balance out each ship/character in the game with some being faster and slower, poweful and weak, etc...

So, maybe try another character.

[Keranu]

So, maybe try another character.

Pricisely   .

[Ceph]

Hi folks, I'm new here. I just discovered this forum and since I'm a long time fan of NEC's litte wondermachine, I chose to register. After looking around a bit I found this topic.

I'm very sorry I didn't come here earlier so I could have warned you: The copies of Sapphire which that guy sold on ebay are indeed counterfeits.

They were made around mid 2001; not '99 or 2000 as this scammer writes on his page. I was in Tokyo at that time and I am pretty sure there were NO fake Sapphires then.

The people who made them (most likely in Asia) did not have access to Hudson's original printing templates, so they had to use an original copy as "master" which they scanned. Since the original was printed using the offset printing method, the colored parts consist of tiny little dots, while black lines are very sharp. When reprinting it from the scans, this could not be duplicated, of course. That's why the counterfeits are slightly blurred / out of focus. When you look closer, you'll also notice that the colors don't quite match: All parts that are yellow in the original are almost orange in the copy (for instance the katakana writing), the purple vest of the girl on the cover is blue in the counterfeit.

Another thing the fraudsters didn't manage to replicate exactly is the factory seal's tear strip: The original was approximately 0.5cm from the bottom while theirs is higher up in the middle of the katakana letters. Maybe their equipment couldn't do it or maybe they had no original sealed copy for reference. Another thing they simply _could_not_ copy is the serial number on the inner ring of the original CD, which is identical for all original copies.

Those counterfeits were produced for one purpose only: To scam unsuspecting collectors out of a lot of money. Of course this only worked for a short time (until it became known that counterfeits were out there).

I had a good laugh when reading that German scammer's website http://sapphire.anime4ever.de/
"Alternative copies" - what a funny euphemism. Basically all he writes there is complete bullsh*t. Why would a game copany issue a second print run to keep prices down on the secondary market?? Hudson never did such a thing, and not a single shop in Tokyo claims they did. This is, plain and simple, a lie.

Too bad so many of you fell for this. I contacted ebay about the counterfeits several times, they chose not react (just as usual). The guy who sold the counterfeits on ebay (ebay name asian_dvd_classics) knew full well he was selling bootlegs - that's why his auctions were set to "private"; that way the people who bought the fakes couldn't even be warned. You may think that $60 for a nicely made replica isn't a bad price... I'm sure it wasn't for asian_dvd_classics who paid considerably less when he purchased a box full somewhere in Asia and made some $10000 selling them during the past 3 months. I for one think that even $5 is too much for a bootleg. I also think that he is a criminal who should be prosecuted and punished to the full extent. Anyone here know his real name?

[MotherGunner]

Hi Ceph,  First off welcome to the forums, we always like to welcome new members, as I was fully welcomed by everyone here.

However, I must point out that we all know that these are bootlegs, and guess what?  We don't care.  Most will agree that $500 for a game is too much.  For us, buying a really good bootleg is just as good, even though it me be about the price of a new PS2, or Xbox game.

With that in mind, it is not necessary to flame Fudoh by calling him a scammer.  After all, no one forced us to buy his copies.  Most of us are adult enough to know we are paying for bootlegs.  As mentioned, we really don't care.  It works well, and looks great with the rest of our collection.  As long as there are no errors, I'm fine with it.

Fudoh was a really nice guy and came through with the product.  If he was stealing our money, he would be a scammer but he is not.  He is merely providing a product that people want.

I also think most of us feel less guilty seeing a copy that has a spine card, booklet and case (bootleg or not).  

I think the collectors like Bullseye are the real scammers.  If you read on to our forums, most people frown upon other people that rat people out on ebay for the wrong reasons.  Fudoh sold his copies buy it now for $59.95 while some of his customers turned around and where asking for nearly double or triple.  Those are the real scammers.

Im not mad at you.  Your point is accepted, and noted.  This is a case of good intention bad judgement.

Fudoh may be a father with children to feed.  He has to do what he has to do.  If selling those copies put food on the table for his wife and children, than it was worth it.

[Keranu]

Ceph, I think you should check out this thread https://www.pcengine-fx.com/forums/index.php?topic=846&highlight=sapphire+laser+disc . PCEngineHell makes some excellent points why it might not be a counterfit. I believe it's not a counterfit either mainly because of Michael's reasons, but I can't say I believe Fudoh's story about these alternate Sapphires being a second run by Hudson. I think it could be a possibility, but who knows? For now from the facts I have gathered, mainly from Michael, is that I believe it's not a counterfit.