PC Engine Homebrew News: The duo that brought you FX-Unit Yuki returns! A demo for "Nyanja!" is available, an action platformer akin to games like Bubble Bobble & Snow Bros in gameplay style.
Main Menu

It's MML time.

Started by Arkhan Asylum, 02/28/2010, 04:59 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

0 Members and 0 Guests are viewing this topic.

Arkhan Asylum

There is a test of the new and improved Squirrel.  Anyone who's MML savvy should be able to pick up and go with ease, and anyone new to MML will see that it is not as scary as everyone claims (Most of that is thanks to HuSIC).

As the description says, working out some kinks before the public release, but there is proof of concept for you all :)

It'll come with a pretty solid instruction manual
This "max-level forum psycho" (:lol:) destroyed TWO PC Engine groups in rage: one by Aaron Lambert on Facebook "Because Chris 'Shadowland' Runyon!," then the other by Aaron Nanto "Because Le NightWolve!" Him and PCE Aarons don't have a good track record together... Both times he blamed the Aarons in a "Look-what-you-made-us-do?!" manner, never himself nor his deranged, destructive, toxic turbo troll gang!

peperocket

Great news ! =D>

I'm in a hurry to test it !
Vive la Supergrafx !!!

Arkhan Asylum

UPDATE:

It's comin along.  Pretty near ready to give out to budding musicians to both enjoy, and bugtest!

This will be a beta release of course, and any bugs should definitely be pointed out to me!

I am currently working on the instruction manual.  Hopefully it is as clear as I hope!
This "max-level forum psycho" (:lol:) destroyed TWO PC Engine groups in rage: one by Aaron Lambert on Facebook "Because Chris 'Shadowland' Runyon!," then the other by Aaron Nanto "Because Le NightWolve!" Him and PCE Aarons don't have a good track record together... Both times he blamed the Aarons in a "Look-what-you-made-us-do?!" manner, never himself nor his deranged, destructive, toxic turbo troll gang!

Arkhan Asylum

The manual is done, and has been read by a few people.  Both people who know this kinda thing already, and those who dont know much about MML and admit to being poor at music.


Both types gave the thumbs up!

I've been spotting a few bugs, Aetherbyte's getting it all straightened out, and another sample song or two is being worked on for the release of it.

So, PCE music is going to be ALIVE AGAIN!
This "max-level forum psycho" (:lol:) destroyed TWO PC Engine groups in rage: one by Aaron Lambert on Facebook "Because Chris 'Shadowland' Runyon!," then the other by Aaron Nanto "Because Le NightWolve!" Him and PCE Aarons don't have a good track record together... Both times he blamed the Aarons in a "Look-what-you-made-us-do?!" manner, never himself nor his deranged, destructive, toxic turbo troll gang!

Arkhan Asylum

Oh if only we had this game on the PCE.

Made a pretty nice tune I think!

Done with MML!
This "max-level forum psycho" (:lol:) destroyed TWO PC Engine groups in rage: one by Aaron Lambert on Facebook "Because Chris 'Shadowland' Runyon!," then the other by Aaron Nanto "Because Le NightWolve!" Him and PCE Aarons don't have a good track record together... Both times he blamed the Aarons in a "Look-what-you-made-us-do?!" manner, never himself nor his deranged, destructive, toxic turbo troll gang!

peperocket

Good sound, I love it !!

When can we expect to use new Squirrel ?
Vive la Supergrafx !!!

Arkhan Asylum

Quote from: peperocket on 03/23/2010, 11:19 AMGood sound, I love it !!

When can we expect to use new Squirrel ?
Pretty soon, I'd gather.

Some of the tweaks, testing, and experimenting took a bit longer than planned.  Especially with school and other crap going on!
This "max-level forum psycho" (:lol:) destroyed TWO PC Engine groups in rage: one by Aaron Lambert on Facebook "Because Chris 'Shadowland' Runyon!," then the other by Aaron Nanto "Because Le NightWolve!" Him and PCE Aarons don't have a good track record together... Both times he blamed the Aarons in a "Look-what-you-made-us-do?!" manner, never himself nor his deranged, destructive, toxic turbo troll gang!

_Paul

I wish I had more than a microbe of muscial talent so I could make use of this.

Ninja Spirit

I always wanted to learn MML...

tired of wrestling with triplets on Famitracker and Fruity Loops

Arkhan Asylum

Quote from: Ninja Spirit on 03/24/2010, 09:50 AMI always wanted to learn MML...

tired of wrestling with triplets on Famitracker and Fruity Loops
If you understand the piano roll of fruity loops, youre like 80% to understanding MML man!
 
the lengths of the bars of the piano roll translate 1:1 to MML :)  You could type fruityloops stuff right in and be good to go.   
This "max-level forum psycho" (:lol:) destroyed TWO PC Engine groups in rage: one by Aaron Lambert on Facebook "Because Chris 'Shadowland' Runyon!," then the other by Aaron Nanto "Because Le NightWolve!" Him and PCE Aarons don't have a good track record together... Both times he blamed the Aarons in a "Look-what-you-made-us-do?!" manner, never himself nor his deranged, destructive, toxic turbo troll gang!

Ninja Spirit

Quote from: Psycho Arkhan on 03/24/2010, 12:36 PM
Quote from: Ninja Spirit on 03/24/2010, 09:50 AMI always wanted to learn MML...

tired of wrestling with triplets on Famitracker and Fruity Loops
If you understand the piano roll of fruity loops, youre like 80% to understanding MML man!
 
the lengths of the bars of the piano roll translate 1:1 to MML :)  You could type fruityloops stuff right in and be good to go.   
Ah ok. For me, it's just a matter of learning to actually put in all that code into a notepad as opposed to piano rolls.

I must've read this a dozen times
http://www.shauninman.com/assets/downloads/ppmck_guide.html?caught#What


OldMan

Wow. If you're trying to understand MML from that, my hat's off to you. You really only need the part below "musical Notation" to get something playing.
MML is a lot like the old basic play strings. Give it a bunch of notes, and let it play them :-

Arkhan Asylum

#12
Quote from: Ninja Spirit on 03/24/2010, 02:46 PM
Quote from: Psycho Arkhan on 03/24/2010, 12:36 PM
Quote from: Ninja Spirit on 03/24/2010, 09:50 AMI always wanted to learn MML...

tired of wrestling with triplets on Famitracker and Fruity Loops
If you understand the piano roll of fruity loops, youre like 80% to understanding MML man!
 
the lengths of the bars of the piano roll translate 1:1 to MML :)  You could type fruityloops stuff right in and be good to go.   
Ah ok. For me, it's just a matter of learning to actually put in all that code into a notepad as opposed to piano rolls.

I must've read this a dozen times
http://www.shauninman.com/assets/downloads/ppmck_guide.html?caught#What
WHOAAA ninjer spirit.  Do NOT use that.  It will only serve to scare you, confuse you, and give you a headache.  That setup is for people who are A) Crazy! B) Experienced with programming AND music or C) Japanese.

Don't worry.  I have many example songs , a few short, a few long, that will be included for you to learn from, and a very detailed manual.  You should have no trouble picking up on things from there and seeing how simple it is, especially if you are used to FruityLoopin'.  What you will get with Squirrel is just as powerful as ppmck/husic, but much easier to get going.


This "max-level forum psycho" (:lol:) destroyed TWO PC Engine groups in rage: one by Aaron Lambert on Facebook "Because Chris 'Shadowland' Runyon!," then the other by Aaron Nanto "Because Le NightWolve!" Him and PCE Aarons don't have a good track record together... Both times he blamed the Aarons in a "Look-what-you-made-us-do?!" manner, never himself nor his deranged, destructive, toxic turbo troll gang!

Ninja Spirit

one drawback I won't be able to use Konami's Gradius/Salamander/Twinbee drums

Arkhan Asylum

Quote from: Ninja Spirit on 03/25/2010, 10:37 AMone drawback I won't be able to use Konami's Gradius/Salamander/Twinbee drums
yet.

:)

For now however with some fiddling and experimenting, you can pull of some nice drums.

ANYWAY:

A small update!

I will be releasing the compiler w/ 4 examples and detailed manual later today.  I get home from school in about 5 hours and will clean it all up and have it up on the internets in good time.

I will post a link to it here once it is ready.

It will be CD-ROM only while the HuCard portion gets straightened out.   Minor setback, but I think everyone's been waiting long enough and wants to mess around with it and see what they get out of it!

When it is out, I encourage everyone who tries it to look at the examples first, and read the manual.  Then try out your own stuff, and either make nice tunes, or break everything, point out problems you have noticed,  and ask me tons of questions.

I am being very serious too!  I am looking forward to answering questions, and things that may have been overlooked!    I am 100% ready and willing to assist everyone in learning MML.

*thumbs up* 
This "max-level forum psycho" (:lol:) destroyed TWO PC Engine groups in rage: one by Aaron Lambert on Facebook "Because Chris 'Shadowland' Runyon!," then the other by Aaron Nanto "Because Le NightWolve!" Him and PCE Aarons don't have a good track record together... Both times he blamed the Aarons in a "Look-what-you-made-us-do?!" manner, never himself nor his deranged, destructive, toxic turbo troll gang!

ParanoiaDragon

What about the drums used in games like Shubibinman 1 & 2, they had a great sound engine!  And actually, I'm one of those guys that really liked Irem's sound engine!
IMG

Arkhan Asylum

well, you can fiddle around with the noise drums and probably do the shubibin man stuff without too much difficulty.   I like the drums in those games also.

anyway, this beast will be up within the hour unless my internet shuts off or i implode
This "max-level forum psycho" (:lol:) destroyed TWO PC Engine groups in rage: one by Aaron Lambert on Facebook "Because Chris 'Shadowland' Runyon!," then the other by Aaron Nanto "Because Le NightWolve!" Him and PCE Aarons don't have a good track record together... Both times he blamed the Aarons in a "Look-what-you-made-us-do?!" manner, never himself nor his deranged, destructive, toxic turbo troll gang!

Vecanti

Quote from: Psycho Arkhan on 03/25/2010, 11:51 PMwell, you can fiddle around with the noise drums and probably do the shubibin man stuff without too much difficulty.   I like the drums in those games also.

anyway, this beast will be up within the hour unless my internet shuts off or i implode
I'll be waiting!  This is so awesome!


Arkhan Asylum

Quote from: GobanToba on 03/26/2010, 12:01 AM
Quote from: Psycho Arkhan on 03/25/2010, 11:51 PMwell, you can fiddle around with the noise drums and probably do the shubibin man stuff without too much difficulty.   I like the drums in those games also.

anyway, this beast will be up within the hour unless my internet shuts off or i implode
I'll be waiting!  This is so awesome!
just cleaning up the manual and the example files and then SHABAM, itll be rdy2go!
This "max-level forum psycho" (:lol:) destroyed TWO PC Engine groups in rage: one by Aaron Lambert on Facebook "Because Chris 'Shadowland' Runyon!," then the other by Aaron Nanto "Because Le NightWolve!" Him and PCE Aarons don't have a good track record together... Both times he blamed the Aarons in a "Look-what-you-made-us-do?!" manner, never himself nor his deranged, destructive, toxic turbo troll gang!

Arkhan Asylum

OK it is live!

http://aetherbyte.com/psg.htm

Get it here, and let the carnage commence!
This "max-level forum psycho" (:lol:) destroyed TWO PC Engine groups in rage: one by Aaron Lambert on Facebook "Because Chris 'Shadowland' Runyon!," then the other by Aaron Nanto "Because Le NightWolve!" Him and PCE Aarons don't have a good track record together... Both times he blamed the Aarons in a "Look-what-you-made-us-do?!" manner, never himself nor his deranged, destructive, toxic turbo troll gang!

Vecanti

Quote from: Psycho Arkhan on 03/26/2010, 01:19 AMOK it is live!

http://aetherbyte.com/psg.htm

Get it here, and let the carnage commence!
It works!  Compiled the first example song and worked perfect.  This is so awesome.  I know nothing of MML itself, but I will play around with it.  So excited I can actually create some music through my duo :) 

Thanks so much!!

Arkhan Asylum

glad to hear it.

I think you will find that after a bit of playing around, its pretty easy to get the hang of, and you can always use a different composing program (FruityLoops possibly) to create your music, and then once you have note lengths, and the like, you can type it in as MML!

 What I think would be great is if once more people start using it, everyone shares their music files for others to learn off of.

Open source music :D
This "max-level forum psycho" (:lol:) destroyed TWO PC Engine groups in rage: one by Aaron Lambert on Facebook "Because Chris 'Shadowland' Runyon!," then the other by Aaron Nanto "Because Le NightWolve!" Him and PCE Aarons don't have a good track record together... Both times he blamed the Aarons in a "Look-what-you-made-us-do?!" manner, never himself nor his deranged, destructive, toxic turbo troll gang!

Vecanti

Quote from: Psycho Arkhan on 03/26/2010, 02:30 AMWhat I think would be great is if once more people start using it, everyone shares their music files for others to learn off of.

Open source music :D
Well, I made something at least.  I'm sure I did it all wrong, but it's my first try!

I put up the .mml and the iso (~900kb)

http://turboduo.org/mml/


Arkhan Asylum

interesting!

I only looked quickly, but I think i only see a few hiccups.  I think a few lines may be too long, and .CHANNEL commands need to be on their own lines.

when I get in from work in about 2 hrs, i will have a harder look and see everything!


This "max-level forum psycho" (:lol:) destroyed TWO PC Engine groups in rage: one by Aaron Lambert on Facebook "Because Chris 'Shadowland' Runyon!," then the other by Aaron Nanto "Because Le NightWolve!" Him and PCE Aarons don't have a good track record together... Both times he blamed the Aarons in a "Look-what-you-made-us-do?!" manner, never himself nor his deranged, destructive, toxic turbo troll gang!

Vecanti

Quote from: Psycho Arkhan on 03/26/2010, 03:14 PMinteresting!

I only looked quickly, but I think i only see a few hiccups.  I think a few lines may be too long, and .CHANNEL commands need to be on their own lines.

when I get in from work in about 2 hrs, i will have a harder look and see everything!
Yeah, I really have no idea what I'm doing.  So I'm guessing line length plays into this.  Trying to find a good (text?)editor.  If I load them in notepad some are just one long line, some seem to be formated.

Fun though!

Vecanti

Oh, I read the readme.txt.  That helped a ton. ;-)

Got some Lady Gaga rockin' on the PCE :-)


Vecanti

OK, I re-uploaded my song:
http://turboduo.org/mml/

Sounds much more like I wanted.  I think we need to start a list (if one doesn't exist) of cool Waveform/settings that we like.  Right now I'm just using yours and tweaking them to see what happens. :-)


Arkhan Asylum

Quote from: GobanToba on 03/26/2010, 05:33 PMOK, I re-uploaded my song:
http://turboduo.org/mml/

Sounds much more like I wanted.  I think we need to start a list (if one doesn't exist) of cool Waveform/settings that we like.  Right now I'm just using yours and tweaking them to see what happens. :-)
Goban, go to aetherbyte.com/forum and sign up!

there is an MML category, and I would like to have tons of stickies/mml songs posted there for everyone

figure if you put the songs in a codeblock, itll be good to go!


Also, Agony sounds great on the PCE.   I really dig it.  What a game.
This "max-level forum psycho" (:lol:) destroyed TWO PC Engine groups in rage: one by Aaron Lambert on Facebook "Because Chris 'Shadowland' Runyon!," then the other by Aaron Nanto "Because Le NightWolve!" Him and PCE Aarons don't have a good track record together... Both times he blamed the Aarons in a "Look-what-you-made-us-do?!" manner, never himself nor his deranged, destructive, toxic turbo troll gang!

OldMan

Goban: May I use the original mml for agony for testing ? I like the gurgle effect :-)

Arkhan Asylum

#29
Quote from: TheOldMan on 03/26/2010, 11:55 PMGoban: May I use the original mml for agony for testing ? I like the gurgle effect :-)
those were the side effect of typos while delimiting each channel (stray .'s).   Also from a line that was too long for the compiler.  :D

The modulation wave in the file is pretty basic. (lifted from an example I provided I think)

This "max-level forum psycho" (:lol:) destroyed TWO PC Engine groups in rage: one by Aaron Lambert on Facebook "Because Chris 'Shadowland' Runyon!," then the other by Aaron Nanto "Because Le NightWolve!" Him and PCE Aarons don't have a good track record together... Both times he blamed the Aarons in a "Look-what-you-made-us-do?!" manner, never himself nor his deranged, destructive, toxic turbo troll gang!

Vecanti

Quote from: TheOldMan on 03/26/2010, 11:55 PMGoban: May I use the original mml for agony for testing ? I like the gurgle effect :-)
Of course.  Feel free to do whatever you want with it.  I think looking at these files and modding them is a really good way to learn.


Vecanti

Quote from: Psycho Arkhan on 03/27/2010, 12:22 AM
Quote from: TheOldMan on 03/26/2010, 11:55 PMGoban: May I use the original mml for agony for testing ? I like the gurgle effect :-)
those were the side effect of typos while delimiting each channel (stray .'s).   Also from a line that was too long for the compiler.  :D

The modulation wave in the file is pretty basic. (lifted from an example I provided I think)
Yeah I think I used sounds you used.  I changed some of the channels around a bit.  Are the . not suppose to be in there?   I need to read some more! :)


Arkhan Asylum

.TRACK  Agony


.CHANNEL 0  Setup
T35 V31 L1 ^D0

[u][b].[/b][/u]

CHANNEL 1  Organ

I bolded the problems.  Actually problem.    The other dot I thought I saw turned out to be a spec of dust on the screen, lol

The . does need to be there, but it must be ".channel 1"   just like that.

I know the manual says the compiler ignores whitespace, but it only does it for the MML commands.  For like when you are entering notes, and such!

.TRACK, .CHANNEL, .WAVE, .ENVELOPE, etc. aren't exactly MML commands.  They are more like "section commands".
This "max-level forum psycho" (:lol:) destroyed TWO PC Engine groups in rage: one by Aaron Lambert on Facebook "Because Chris 'Shadowland' Runyon!," then the other by Aaron Nanto "Because Le NightWolve!" Him and PCE Aarons don't have a good track record together... Both times he blamed the Aarons in a "Look-what-you-made-us-do?!" manner, never himself nor his deranged, destructive, toxic turbo troll gang!

Vecanti

>>The . does need to be there, but it must be ".channel 1"   just like that.

Ah I see it.  I was thinking you meant the "dot extender" was not suppose to be used and I was totally confused.  

I didn't even notice the  space, but I totally got you.  Needs to be next to the command.  It would be like calling a function in C++ like   character . draw()   ;-)


I read through the read me and just wanted to say that it is really well done.  I usually skip those because they are useless, but I should have read the whole thing first.  Excellent work!


Ninja Spirit

#34
I think I hit a brick wall. About the soundtest.c file, what program do you use to open it? Currently on my laptop it's an unknown file type which asks me to open from the program list or have the web search for it.

Arkhan Asylum

Quote from: Ninja Spirit on 03/27/2010, 04:43 PMI think I hit a brick wall. About the soundtest.c file, what program do you use to open it? Currently on my laptop it's an unknown file type which asks me to open from the program list or have the web search for it.
Oh!  You need not open the file or look at it much at all.   You just need to have huc installed .

HuC is the PCE/TG16 C compiler at zeograd.com

I will try finding you on the yahoos to help if you need it. 
This "max-level forum psycho" (:lol:) destroyed TWO PC Engine groups in rage: one by Aaron Lambert on Facebook "Because Chris 'Shadowland' Runyon!," then the other by Aaron Nanto "Because Le NightWolve!" Him and PCE Aarons don't have a good track record together... Both times he blamed the Aarons in a "Look-what-you-made-us-do?!" manner, never himself nor his deranged, destructive, toxic turbo troll gang!

hcf

This new version of Squirrel seems to be awesome. It's very nice to see all the people in this forum that are sharing very usefull libraries. In my opinion, this is the best way to make our scene grow.

As far as Squirrel is related, I have been able to create ISOs with the example MML files, and they work perfect. This is amazing :) 

The bad thing is that I am trying to go one step beyond. I have a lot of MID files, and I am trying to convert them to MML and use them with Squirrel. I have used several programs: midimml2.2, tinymml, and even the wonderfull 3MLE (it can convert MID files to 3 different styles of MML: Mabinogi, Thread and MabiMML). So, I got 5 different MML files (one for each method of conversion) but none of them worked with Squirrel. Even I tried to edit the Cathedral.MML sample and replace the inner part of the channels with the one generated by these programs, and it doesn't work :(

And this is a pity, because people WITHOUT a deep musical knowledge would be very happy if we can convert MID files to MML and import them with Squirrel later. We are not able to compose our own MML music, but in Internet there are tons of MID files to import. So, I would like to ask you... have you ever tried one of this MID to MML programs, and do you know if there are any of them which generates code compatible with Squirrel? If that tool does exist, the combo "Squirrel+That Tool" would be the perfect way to create music for PC Engine!! :D

In any case, even if this tool doesn't exist, your work is very nice. Congratulations! :)

Arkhan Asylum

you probably can't copy stuff converted with those programs directly over, as they all add little delimiters between channels that are inconsistent.


Post one of the conversions here, and I can take a look at it and see.  Its probably a matter of having to remove some excess-stuff, so the Squirrel compiler doesn't get a bunch of weird stuff


Here is something I finished last night:

www.aetherbyte.com/downloadables/AetherbyteTheme.mp3
This "max-level forum psycho" (:lol:) destroyed TWO PC Engine groups in rage: one by Aaron Lambert on Facebook "Because Chris 'Shadowland' Runyon!," then the other by Aaron Nanto "Because Le NightWolve!" Him and PCE Aarons don't have a good track record together... Both times he blamed the Aarons in a "Look-what-you-made-us-do?!" manner, never himself nor his deranged, destructive, toxic turbo troll gang!

_Paul

Do you know anything about ABC music notation? It would be amazing if squirrel could read ABC files (MMORPG Lord of the Rings Online does this for it's custom player music and it's basically jsut a text file).

Arkhan Asylum

Quote from: guest on 03/29/2010, 02:52 PMDo you know anything about ABC music notation? It would be amazing if squirrel could read ABC files (MMORPG Lord of the Rings Online does this for it's custom player music and it's basically jsut a text file).
No idea, but I wouldn't reckon it'd be too hard to convert from that to MML.
This "max-level forum psycho" (:lol:) destroyed TWO PC Engine groups in rage: one by Aaron Lambert on Facebook "Because Chris 'Shadowland' Runyon!," then the other by Aaron Nanto "Because Le NightWolve!" Him and PCE Aarons don't have a good track record together... Both times he blamed the Aarons in a "Look-what-you-made-us-do?!" manner, never himself nor his deranged, destructive, toxic turbo troll gang!

_Paul

Quote from: Psycho Arkhan on 03/29/2010, 04:49 PM
Quote from: guest on 03/29/2010, 02:52 PMDo you know anything about ABC music notation? It would be amazing if squirrel could read ABC files (MMORPG Lord of the Rings Online does this for it's custom player music and it's basically jsut a text file).
No idea, but I wouldn't reckon it'd be too hard to convert from that to MML.
Hopefully I can find some time to look into that. There are loads of ABC files on the net, and I've got a good midi->ABC converter.

Arkhan Asylum

Quote from: guest on 03/29/2010, 06:59 PM
Quote from: Psycho Arkhan on 03/29/2010, 04:49 PM
Quote from: guest on 03/29/2010, 02:52 PMDo you know anything about ABC music notation? It would be amazing if squirrel could read ABC files (MMORPG Lord of the Rings Online does this for it's custom player music and it's basically jsut a text file).
No idea, but I wouldn't reckon it'd be too hard to convert from that to MML.
Hopefully I can find some time to look into that. There are loads of ABC files on the net, and I've got a good midi->ABC converter.
got a good ABC to MIDI converter?
This "max-level forum psycho" (:lol:) destroyed TWO PC Engine groups in rage: one by Aaron Lambert on Facebook "Because Chris 'Shadowland' Runyon!," then the other by Aaron Nanto "Because Le NightWolve!" Him and PCE Aarons don't have a good track record together... Both times he blamed the Aarons in a "Look-what-you-made-us-do?!" manner, never himself nor his deranged, destructive, toxic turbo troll gang!

OldMan

hcf: I'm not an expert on the subject, but I do know that if you have midi files, it's not very hard to find a program that will export them as mml. You do have to clean up the files and convert them to the squirrel format, but that's a lot easier than trying to re-enter all that information. Somewhere floating around I have the source to a program that reads mabinogi formatted mml, and strips out the stuff you don't need. Then it's a simple matter to paste that information into the skeleton squirrel file to get a working starting point.

sunteam_paul. I actually looked up the abc music format. Unsurprisingly, it is a lot like mml, wth the only real
differences being in the header information (most of which isn't important to the sound anyway) and the addition of measure markers. I'm sure it would be no big deal to convert between ABC and MML, but right
now I'm too busy to take on another project. Anyone really good at pearl out there? Seems like it would be a natural fit....

Arkhan Asylum

Quote from: TheOldMan on 03/29/2010, 10:17 PMhcf: I'm not an expert on the subject, but I do know that if you have midi files, it's not very hard to find a program that will export them as mml. You do have to clean up the files and convert them to the squirrel format, but that's a lot easier than trying to re-enter all that information. Somewhere floating around I have the source to a program that reads mabinogi formatted mml, and strips out the stuff you don't need. Then it's a simple matter to paste that information into the skeleton squirrel file to get a working starting point.
Yep, nearly every "midi to MML" converter in existence seems to have its own style once output to the MML file.  Some are very sloppy, and full of extra-stuff that probably made it easier on the converter writer, or because it was tailored to a specific player THEY had, that none of us do, and its not around anymore. 

outside of the standard , general MML syntax, the way you lay the file out is kind of up to the author, but a few more defined standards have been set in place over the years. 

The HuSIC/MCK style, the Mabinogi Style, and the Develo style, which is basically lifted/reworked from the generally accepted MSX style.

This "max-level forum psycho" (:lol:) destroyed TWO PC Engine groups in rage: one by Aaron Lambert on Facebook "Because Chris 'Shadowland' Runyon!," then the other by Aaron Nanto "Because Le NightWolve!" Him and PCE Aarons don't have a good track record together... Both times he blamed the Aarons in a "Look-what-you-made-us-do?!" manner, never himself nor his deranged, destructive, toxic turbo troll gang!

hcf

Thanks for the answers. I'm going to post the results of the 5 programs that I have to convert MID to MML. Also, I have tried to replace the CHANNEL section of the "Cathedral.MML" sample with these results, and I was not lucky. Maybe if you see these conversions you can tell us which one is closer to the standard MML required by Squirrel, and what are the things that we must erase (and paste them in the CHANNEL section). As TheOldMan said, this is easier than making the MML from scratch (even more for people without musical knowledge). These are the results:

Tinymm:

{ Ch 01 ===================================== }
r1
o3c4^8g4^16^32o4c4^32
o3f4^8^32o4c4^16^32o3f4
c4^8e4^16^32g8<c2^4^8
>g4^32
c4^8g4^8<c4
>f4^16^32r32<c4^16^32o3f4c4^32
g+4^16^32r32a+4^16^32o4c4^8^32
>g16r16g4c8^16r16
c4^8g4^8<c4
o3f4^8<c4^16^32o3f4^32
c4^8e4^16^32g8<c2^4^8
o3g4c4^8^32
g4^16^32r32o4c4
>f4^8<c4^16^32r32o3f8^16^32c4^32
g+4^8a+4^16^32<c2^4^16^32
;
{ Ch 02 ===================================== }
r1^4^32
<g32r16f+16r16f16r16d+8r8e8
r8>g+16^32r32a8o6c4^32o5a16^32<c16^32r32d8^32
r8^16^32g16^32r32f+16r16f16r16d+8^16^32r32e8^32
r16<c8^16r16c16^32r32c2r4^32
>g16r32f+16r16f16^32r32d+16^32r8^16e16^32r8^32
o5g+8a16^32r32o6c4o5a8<c16^32d4^16
r16^32d+4^16r16d4^16r32c2^32
r2^8^16^32
g16^32r32f+16r16f16r16d+4^32e4^32
o5g+16^32a8o6c4o5a8<c16^32d4
r8^32g16r16f+32r16^32f16^32r32d+4e8^16
r16<c8^16r32c16^32r32c2^32
r8^16^32o6g8f+16^32r32f16r16d+4e4^16
>g+8a8<c8^16^32>a8<c16^32d4^8
r32d+4^16^32d4^8>g1^16
;


3MLE Mabinogi:

MML@r1rv11l8>gv12f+v11fv13d+4v11e4v10<g+v12av13>c4.v12cd4.v11gv12f+v11fd+4v12e.&e32>c4v11cc2.&c32v12<g16.f+fv11d+4&d+32e4v9<g+v11av12b+4v11av12>c16.v13l4.d&d32d+d4&d16.v12c1&c4v11g8v12f+8v11f8v12d+4&d+32v11ev12<av11a8.&a32l32>d4.&dg16.v12f+8v11f8&fv12d+4v10e4v11>c8.&cc8c2.v10l4<gf8v12d+v9e&e16l8<g+v6av10>c.&c32v9<av10l16.>cv7d4.&d32v13d+4&d+v12d4.<g1&g16,r1v11o2c.v10g&g16.>c&c32<f2.f2&f8e.&e16.v9>c2.&c8v10<g&g32c.g.b+f&f16.b+.fc&c32v12g+.a+2.v11g8v10gv11cv10c.g.b+v9f.>c&c16.<f&f32v10c.e.&e16.>c2.&c8<gc.&c32g&g16.>c&c32v9l4.<fv10b+v7l16.f4.&fv12g+4.&g+32v13a+4&a+v11>c2.&c,t167;

3MLE Thread:

y‹È–¼z
yo"Tz
yì‹È‰Â"\ƒ‰ƒ"ƒNzD (352/220/4)

MML@
r1rv11l8>gv12f+v11fv13d+4v11e4v10<g+v12av13>c4.v12cd4.v11gv12f+v11fd+4v12e.&e32>c4v11cc2.&c32v12<g16.f+fv11d+4&d+32e4v9<g+v11av12b+4v11av12>c16.v13l4.d&d32d+d4&d16.v12c1&c4v11g8v12f+8v11f8v12d+4&d+32v11ev12<av11a8.&a32l32>d4.&dg16.v12f+8v11f8&fv12d+4v10e4v11>c8.&cc8c2.v10l4<gf8v12d+v9e&e16l8<g+v6av10>c.&c32v9<av10l16.>cv7d4.&d32v13d+4&d+v12d4.<g1&g16
,
r1v11o2c.v10g&g16.>c&c32<f2.f2&f8e.&e16.v9>c2.&c8v10<g&g32c.g.b+f&f16.b+.fc&c32v12g+.a+2.v11g8v10gv11cv10c.g.b+v9f.>c&c16.<f&f32v10c.e.&e16.>c2.&c8<gc.&c32g&g16.>c&c32v9l4.<fv10b+v7l16.f4.&fv12g+4.&g+32v13a+4&a+v11>c2.&c
,
t167
;


3MLE MabiMML:

[Settings]
Title=
Source=
Memo=
TimeBase=32
TimeSignatureNN=4
TimeSignatureDD=4
Instrument1=128
Instrument2=128
Instrument3=128
Instrument4=128
TrackName1=Track1
TrackName2=Track2
TrackName3=Track3
TrackName4=Track4

[Channel1]
//#using_extension
//#using_channel = 0


/*M 0  */  t167
[Channel2]
//#using_extension
//#using_channel = 1

// Bass

/*M 0  */  V97@35r1
/*M 1  */  v11o2c4.v10g4&g16.>c4&c32
/*M 2  */  <f2.f2&
/*M 3  */  f8e4.&e16.v9>c2.&
/*M 4  */  c8v10<g4&g32
/*M 5  */  c4.g4.>c4
/*M 6  */  <f4&f16.>c4.<f4c4&
/*M 7  */  c32v12g+4.a+2.
/*M 8  */  v11g8v10g4v11c4
/*M 9  */  v10c4.g4.>c4
/*M 10 */  v9<f4.>c4&c16.<f4&f32
/*M 11 */  v10c4.e4.&e16.>c2.&
/*M 12 */  c8<g4c4.&
/*M 13 */  c32g4&g16.>c4&c32
/*M 14 */  v9<f4.v10>c4.v7<f4.&
/*M 15 */  f16.v12g+4.&g+32v13a+4&a+16.v11>c2.&
/*M 16 */  c16.
[Channel3]
//#using_extension
//#using_channel = 2

// Melody

/*M 0  */  V127@25r1
/*M 1  */  r4v11>g8v12f+8v11f8v13d+4v11e4
/*M 2  */  v10<g+8v12a8v13>c4.v12c8d4.
/*M 3  */  v11g8v12f+8v11f8d+4v12e8.&
/*M 4  */  e32>c4v11c8c2.&
/*M 5  */  c32
/*M 5  */  v12<g16.f+8f8v11d+4&d+32e4
/*M 6  */  v9<g+8v11a8v12>c4v11<a8v12>c16.v13d4.&
/*M 7  */  d32d+4.d4&d16.v12c1&
/*M 8  */  c4
/*M 9  */  v11g8v12f+8v11f8v12d+4&d+32v11e4.
/*M 10 */  v12<a4.v11a8.&a32>d4.&
/*M 11 */  d32g16.v12f+8v11f8&f32v12d+4v10e4
/*M 12 */  v11>c8.&c32c8c2.
/*M 13 */  v10<g4f8v12d+4v9e4&
/*M 14 */  e16<g+8v6a8v10>c8.&c32v9<a8v10>c16.v7d4.&
/*M 15 */  d32
/*M 15 */  v13d+4&d+16.v12d4.<g1&
/*M 16 */  g16
[Channel4]
//#using_extension
//#using_channel = 8

// Sequenced by Mike Martel

/*M 0  */  V100@0

Finally, midimml is a bit buggy and their results are clearly wrong, so I am not going to paste them here.

Thank you very much!!


Arkhan Asylum

Yes you'll see there that each converter added its own unique style format.... mostly just a buncha useless crap that sections off each "channel" or section, and once you are familiar with MML you will notice what is actually MML and what is just a bunch of junk you don't need to worry about. :D   The not-needed stuff, is mostly just specifics to THAT converter and possibly player (3MLE for example.... goes with the Mabinogi game which uses MML files)

They are all pretty much what you would need.  You just have to yank out the MML data itself.

Tinymm would just require you to take whats between the (ch1=======) and place in .channel section of a squirrel file.

The same goes for 3MLE MabiMML.  just grab what is between the [channel ] markers, and ignore the /* M */ stuff, and anything else that begins with a /.  Those are just comments in that editor that mark off each measure of the song, and important bits of info for THAT player only.

don't use that thread one. its far too much work to copy and is a mess.

and the 3ML3 Mabinogi one too....

if this isn't clear to you still, please let me know and I will help more!
 
This "max-level forum psycho" (:lol:) destroyed TWO PC Engine groups in rage: one by Aaron Lambert on Facebook "Because Chris 'Shadowland' Runyon!," then the other by Aaron Nanto "Because Le NightWolve!" Him and PCE Aarons don't have a good track record together... Both times he blamed the Aarons in a "Look-what-you-made-us-do?!" manner, never himself nor his deranged, destructive, toxic turbo troll gang!

hcf

Thank you! I will try TinyMM and 3MLE with MabiMML style again, and I will report my results.

It's curious: I found this 3MLE program, but I didn't know that Mabinogi was in fact a game  :mrgreen:

hcf

I have tested both methods, and the results are a bit discouraging. They DO work indeed (both TinyMM and 3MLE with MabiMML style) but as you said, there is a lot of crap that we must remove (Squirrel dislikes it). After removing all that stuff and replacing the CHANNEL sections, the MML compiles and in fact the game PLAYS music!!! But it is not well synchronized (the tempo is not good, and the voices are not synchronized one with the others). Maybe all that crap is not entirely unusefull  :mrgreen:

For example, I see that there are some characters like ^ or ~ that generate errors. I must try it a bit more, because maybe there is a way to work if we guess the equivalence between this MML styles and the standard one from Squirrel...  :D

OldMan

hcf. Going by what you posted earlier, yeah, you do need to change some stuff. the ^ is actually a tie, so something like c4^16 needs to be changed to c4&c16. note that you have to put the note name in for squirrel. I didn't see any ~'s, so I have no idea what they mean...possibly a slur?

Arkhan Asylum

Quote from: hcf on 03/30/2010, 11:25 AMI have tested both methods, and the results are a bit discouraging. They DO work indeed (both TinyMM and 3MLE with MabiMML style) but as you said, there is a lot of crap that we must remove (Squirrel dislikes it). After removing all that stuff and replacing the CHANNEL sections, the MML compiles and in fact the game PLAYS music!!! But it is not well synchronized (the tempo is not good, and the voices are not synchronized one with the others). Maybe all that crap is not entirely unusefull  :mrgreen:

For example, I see that there are some characters like ^ or ~ that generate errors. I must try it a bit more, because maybe there is a way to work if we guess the equivalence between this MML styles and the standard one from Squirrel...  :D
strange.
~ and ^ are not normal.   We use ^ with squirrel for some of the PCE specific commands.  If something is using it for a note-tie, that is wrong. :(

if you would like, post the squirrel file you are trying to compile and play here, and we can see whats up!

I'm sure its just a few hiccups that come with learning a new language, and also with converting and pulling the data out of a different converter.

Though, the out of sync issues may also (and are probably) caused by stray characters that are not supposed to be in the file.  The compiler will ignore them, but in the process may ignore things you actually need as well (if they are after the ignored character with no spaces), depending where the incorrect characters are at.

generally, if the compiler mentions any errors about ignoring characters, it is best to locate and fix all of these problems before you test the song out, or it will probably be incorrect!

This "max-level forum psycho" (:lol:) destroyed TWO PC Engine groups in rage: one by Aaron Lambert on Facebook "Because Chris 'Shadowland' Runyon!," then the other by Aaron Nanto "Because Le NightWolve!" Him and PCE Aarons don't have a good track record together... Both times he blamed the Aarons in a "Look-what-you-made-us-do?!" manner, never himself nor his deranged, destructive, toxic turbo troll gang!