Best Video Game Developer

[Joe Redifer]

Yeah I remember all of those Capcom Dreamcast fighting games where the backgrounds where high-res and the sprites were super-blocky low-res.  Pissed me off.  Oh well, at least Marvel vs Capcom 2 has soothing jazz music to fall asleep to... errr I mean fight to.

[Seldane]

Every Street Fighter game is the same, hehehe. And there's like a hundred of them, too.

Pokemon rules. Some of the most fun turn-based rpgs I've played.

[esteban]

Yeah but guess what, you can download as many games as you want for FREE! I'm not going to treat collection discs any differently than paying for each ROM myself.

Keranu, that doesn't make any sense. We are discussing the business strategies of two companies. Clearly, Capcom is offering consumers a much better deal when they offer games for $1-3 a pop on a collection versus Nintendo putting out the GBA re-issues ($20) and Wii's VC charging TOO MUCH for only the ROM (at least you have a cart for GBA, a hardcopy that will last forever)! I don't need to even discuss all of the other ways Nintendo consistently milks money from their back-catalog and squeezes everything they can from their established franchises -- the very fact that Nintendo refrains from putting out budget collections speaks volumes. Even the short-lived e-Reader for GBA was clearly designed to milk the old games... until Nintendo realized that they could make even more money by discontinuing the e-reader and selling the same games at an even higher price.

Oh crap, then there is Nintendo making ridiculous hardware requiremments to play Zelda 4 swords -- how much did it cost to play that game with some of your friends? Talk about raping the Zelda franchise! I've lost count of how much money Nintendo expected swindle from consumers with that fiasco alone. If Nintendo simply wanted to make a great game that Zelda fans could enjoy, and be innovative by incorporating multi-player aspects into the franchise, they easily could have. Instead, they put profits over people -- to the extreme.

I don't really think Capcom > Nintendo or Nintendo > Capcom, I think both companies are, at the very least, are equally guilty of exploiting their products and their position in the market.

I think we, as consumers, are perfectly entitled to criticize companies for their business practices. But let's apply the same critique to all the companies who are guilty.

-------------------

But, if we want to be accurate, I think I can convincingly prove that Nintendo is the worst offender! It's simple. Rather than waste our time figuring out how many titles are in each series (are there 30 Zelda titles? 90 Street Fighters?), we should look at this problem in a different way: what company profits the most from these practices? what company has consistently abstained from budget collections?

I would argue that, historically, Nintendo profits the most and purposefully abstains from budget collections. Their long-term business plan is to cold-heartedly squeeze every last penny from consumers. They were charging good money for Urban Champion on VC, for goodness' sake!

Capcom, on the other hand, should be viewed as a pathetic developer who faced decreasing returns on their once-popular franchises and milked them to death. Capcom tried to exploit the short-term success of Mega Man and Street Fighter for as long as possible. Their long-term plan, though, was to put out budget collections of their back-catalog.

Personally, I find Nintendo to be the more cold-hearted strategist: they are much more anti-consumer (since there is a higher price of entry to play their games).

What do you folks think? Am I completely off-base? Am I deluded? Tell me .

[Nazi NecroPhile]

I can see both sides of the argument, but does it matter who's screwing you the hardest?  If I'm going to be ass raped by two companies, is it really important that one of them used some lube?  The collection discs are only a bargain if you actually want all of the games on the disc.  If you only would have bought three or four (if available separately), no money was saved.  For me though, I'd rather pay for a disc or cartridge than a downloaded file.

I don't mind continuing franchises.  Some games in the franchise will rock, some will suck.  Can anyone here name a single franchise that always was substantially improved with each successive release? 

[Keranu]

I'm not saying VC games aren't a rip off, because they are, nor am I saying collection discs are necessarily a bad deal. What I am saying is in my point of view, I don't find repurchasing games to be worth it period most of the time. I just thought GUTS was pushing it a little when he was yelling at people to go download ROMs for free instead of paying $5-10 to play them on the VC when he himself is paying for ROMs as well, be it a different medium.

It's funny you bring up Zelda: Four Swords though because when it comes to Zelda, Capcom has guilt as well . First it starts with those Oracle and Season of Ages games for Gameboy. Not only did they take Nintendo's idea (even if Nintendo allowed it), but they barely bothered to add any new graphics or music in that game since they took most of the graphics straight from Link's Awakening, which was like ten years old by that time. To top it off, they sold the game in two parts when they could've easily just sold it as one.

But it doesn't stop there, Capcom releases Four Swords for GBA. This game includes a port of A Link To The Past as well as it's own little mini game (which can only be played if you have at least two GBA's and two carts). I have finally been able to play that Four Swords game recently with two GBAs and while I was hoping for a meaty multi-player adventure, I was wrong. I realized that this game was just a little demo made by Capcom using the graphics from it's upcomming Zelda GBA game, Minish Cap. So unlike what they might be advertising, you're really only getting a port of a classic Zelda game + a demo of Capcom's upcomming game.

Personally, I find Nintendo to be the more cold-hearted strategist: they are much more anti-consumer (since there is a higher price of entry to play their games).

Once again, I don't disagree what you say about Nintendo, they are a greedy company. However Nintendo sorts of gains an advantage over Capcom in the greed compartment and that's the fact that Nintendo makes consoles, so they can go greedy in terms of hardware, which is what I think is Nintendo's primary greed factor. If Capcom made home consoles, I personally think they would be every bit as greedy as Nintendo in that area.

But in my opinion, it's Capcom's software that makes them more greedy than Nintendo. When a company like Nintendo or Sega makes a sequel, they make sure to do it right and make it beefy for the audience like a sequel should be. Look at the jump from Super Mario Bros 1 to SMB 3, compare that to Mega Man 1 to Mega Man 6. Pathetic ain't it? Within just two games, Mario evolves into something really big and special, but Mega Man can't help but remain the same game-after-game, year-after-year.

When it comes to Street Fighter, instead of making new games, they make "updates". There are like over 30 (possibly many more?) SF games, but the series is primarily made from three games: Street Fighter II, Street Fighter Alpha, and Street Fighter III. I think it's just ridiculous to drag on games this long without taking big further steps.

[CrackTiger]

As far as Mega Man being worse than Pokemon, there are like at least 3x more Mega Man games than Pokemon and most of them are the same damn thing. I look at Mega Man 1 - 6 for NES and the updates in each game or so small it just feels like I am getting an update of the original with more levels rather than a true sequel. I can accept Mega Man 2 as a somewhat decent sequel to the first, but the rest are just ridiculous. And I'm only talking about the NES games here!

The NES Megaman games aren't really anymore more rehashes than the 8 & 16-bit Sonic and Bonk games.

I think that most of the things people have accused Capcom of here are things that most other major publisher/developers are guilty of.

I also think that anyone should feel free to hate Capcom as much as anyone else hates any other particular company. 

[Keranu]

The NES Megaman games aren't really anymore more rehashes than the 8 & 16-bit Sonic and Bonk games.

I slightly agree, but mostly disagree. I agree that besides the growing and shrinking feature of Bonk 3, it's mostly a rehash of Revenge. However Revenge was a fresh sequel to Adventure, better than any Mega Man NES sequels have done. Sonic's sequels did a fine job creating fresh new graphics and coming up with new ideas.

I think that most of the things people have accused Capcom of here are things that most other major publisher/developers are guilty of.

That's probably true but in my opinion, Capcom's guilts are much severe.

I also think that anyone should feel free to hate Capcom as much as anyone else hates any other particular company. 

Thank you! It's hard to be a Capcom-hater since it's such a well-loved company. Please don't think I have no respect at all for Capcom though because Street Fighter II is one of the most revolutionary games ever made.

[CrackTiger]

The NES Megaman games aren't really anymore more rehashes than the 8 & 16-bit Sonic and Bonk games.

I slightly agree, but mostly disagree. I agree that besides the growing and shrinking feature of Bonk 3, it's mostly a rehash of Revenge. However Revenge was a fresh sequel to Adventure, better than any Mega Man NES sequels have done. Sonic's sequels did a fine job creating fresh new graphics and coming up with new ideas.

I think that most of the things people have accused Capcom of here are things that most other major publisher/developers are guilty of.

That's probably true but in my opinion, Capcom's guilts are much severe.

I also think that anyone should feel free to hate Capcom as much as anyone else hates any other particular company. 

Thank you! It's hard to be a Capcom-hater since it's such a well-loved company. Please don't think I have no respect at all for Capcom though because Street Fighter II is one of the most revolutionary games ever made.

Bonk's Revenge is to Bonk's Adventure is what Megaman 2 is to Megaman 1(have you played through all 4 games?).

Both originals were good ideas that weren't fully fleshed out or refined and each sequal is the definitive version of each series. If anything, Megaman 2 adds a lot more than Bonk's revenge does.

The later Megamans become repetative/rehashes as I understand it(I don't have much experience with the series after part III).

But don't forget about the other 7 Bonk games on NES, GB, SNES and Amiga. Just because Nintendo's illegal business practices kept the first batch of 6 Megamans on the same console doesn't change the fact that in roughly the same time period Hudson dropped 10 similar Bonk games on the world.

Plus there's at least 8 of the same kind of Sonic games for Genesis, Sega-CD and Master System.

If anything, Megaman's 8-bit outings are one of the more modest major console serieses. 

Personally, I wish more game serieses wouldn't try to change things so quickly. Or at least the good ones. Too many great games get sequals that have nothing to do with the original. At least Japan got the real SMB2(so did my hometown, but thats another story ).  I'm still waiting for a faithful sequal to Phantasy Star and an Ys style Ys III. 

[Keranu]

Bonk's Revenge is to Bonk's Adventure is what Megaman 2 is to Megaman 1(have you played through all 4 games?).

Like I said, Megaman 2 was decent as a sequel to the first Megaman, but the rest are big rehashes. I still find Bonk's Revenge to be more of a sequel though because of the complete face lift and better mini-games.

But don't forget about the other 7 Bonk games on NES, GB, SNES and Amiga. Just because Nintendo's illegal business practices kept the first batch of 6 Megamans on the same console doesn't change the fact that in roughly the same time period Hudson dropped 10 similar Bonk games on the world.

Some of those Bonk games were just ports and the AMIGA one wasn't even made by Hudson. Further more, the GB and SNES ones are much different from what I know.

The thing is that after Mega Man 2, nothing was really new to the series at all from 2-6. But even after they moved on from the NES, they continued making Megaman games that were extremely similar to each other, not to mention spin-off series that weren't even platformers anymore.

Plus there's at least 8 of the same kind of Sonic games for Genesis, Sega-CD and Master System.

I find all the Sonic games for the consoles to be quite different from each other. They share the same concept of making it to the end of the stage, but gameplay, design, and even soundwise they are all pretty different than each other. For instance Sonic CD has the whole future thing, the Master System has a whole different level layout style, and Sonic 3 & Knuckles introduces shields. Megaman just adds new levels and bosses, which have names that keep getting more ridiculous. Not to mention that Megaman doesn't even fix it's flaws, even today.

Personally, I wish more game serieses wouldn't try to change things so quickly. Or at least the good ones. Too many great games get sequals that have nothing to do with the original. At least Japan got the real SMB2(so did my hometown, but thats another story ).  I'm still waiting for a faithful sequal to Phantasy Star and an Ys style Ys III. 

I agree, but in my opinion, Megaman games over do it. Year-after-year there is a new Megaman game that is the same as the prequel and it's not until another 5 years or so that they decide to make a new series. I would much rather have Capcom make one game and then take it's time to create a good sequel instead of rehashing games to make a quick buck.

[esteban]

Yeah, I don't mind if Keranu hates Capcom . I'm not a Street Fighter fan, myself, so I was able to avoid the onslaught of SF games... although I do want to play SF: The Movie (even if Capcom didn't develop it).

At least the Mega Man sequels aren't as bad as sports games that simply updated the rosters and stats (or are they? )

I don't deny it: I like Mega Man. I don't mind the re-hashes of MM2... especially now, because they're fun. How many times have we said: Oh, I wish they released another Karnov, Legendary Axe, Bionic Commando, Blodia, etc.? OK, maybe most folks don't, but I do!

If a game is good, or has potential, I don't mind if its sequel is simply a tweaked version. Keep in mind: the resulting game has to be solid, otherwise we (as consumers) will probably feel ripped off.  I agree, though, that by Mega Man 4, Capcom should have done more.

Here's what I'd be happy with:

original --> tweaked rehash --> some innovations to keep things fresh --> tweaked rehash of prior title --> concerted effort to introduce new concepts --> tweaked rehash

[GUTS]

Keranu you're not understanding even though I've made it clear quite a few times.  I've said TONS of times that I have no problem paying a reasonable price for roms, for example the collections that give you 20+ games for $20 or if the virtual console games were $1-$3 apiece.  But when the roms are extremely overpriced (like the VC games), I would rather go download them for free and wish everyone else would too to send a message to Nintendo that they are greedy fuckfaces.  I have no problem supporting a company as long as the price is fair.

And I completely agree with Steve here, all companies are guilty of milking stuff, but Nintendo has made an art form of fucking their fans over.

Mega Man and Street fighter rule.  Deal with it.

[Keranu]

Steve, nice post. I can agree with you there.

Well sorry GUTS, I wasn't aware they would be willing to pay for ROMs at all. However I don't think the Virtual Console is designed for people like us though.

Mega Man and Street fighter rule.  Deal with it.

Sorry, I'm not going to deal with that. 

[ParanoiaDragon]

The NES Megaman games aren't really anymore more rehashes than the 8 & 16-bit Sonic and Bonk games.

I slightly agree, but mostly disagree. I agree that besides the growing and shrinking feature of Bonk 3, it's mostly a rehash of Revenge. However Revenge was a fresh sequel to Adventure, better than any Mega Man NES sequels have done. Sonic's sequels did a fine job creating fresh new graphics and coming up with new ideas.

I think that most of the things people have accused Capcom of here are things that most other major publisher/developers are guilty of.

That's probably true but in my opinion, Capcom's guilts are much severe.

I also think that anyone should feel free to hate Capcom as much as anyone else hates any other particular company. 

Thank you! It's hard to be a Capcom-hater since it's such a well-loved company. Please don't think I have no respect at all for Capcom though because Street Fighter II is one of the most revolutionary games ever made.

Bonk's Revenge is to Bonk's Adventure is what Megaman 2 is to Megaman 1(have you played through all 4 games?).

Both originals were good ideas that weren't fully fleshed out or refined and each sequal is the definitive version of each series. If anything, Megaman 2 adds a lot more than Bonk's revenge does.

The later Megamans become repetative/rehashes as I understand it(I don't have much experience with the series after part III).

But don't forget about the other 7 Bonk games on NES, GB, SNES and Amiga. Just because Nintendo's illegal business practices kept the first batch of 6 Megamans on the same console doesn't change the fact that in roughly the same time period Hudson dropped 10 similar Bonk games on the world.

Plus there's at least 8 of the same kind of Sonic games for Genesis, Sega-CD and Master System.

If anything, Megaman's 8-bit outings are one of the more modest major console serieses. 

Personally, I wish more game serieses wouldn't try to change things so quickly. Or at least the good ones. Too many great games get sequals that have nothing to do with the original. At least Japan got the real SMB2(so did my hometown, but thats another story ).  I'm still waiting for a faithful sequal to Phantasy Star and an Ys style Ys III. 

Ys 3 in Ys style?  Look no further the Oath in Felghana, released in the summer of 06.  Beautiful game, beautiful music, & there's an english patch coming soon!  I can't praise the game enough, as it rules!  Though, I think now, Ys Origins is my favorite Ys.  Yeah, the 3 latest Ys aren't bump n' grind like 1, 2, & 4.  But, they're as close as you'll get to the original gameplay, while being being made in this day & age.  I HIGHLY recomend them!

[Joe Redifer]

I can't keep track of all of these crazy Ys games.  Please sort them out for me or I will send you an annoying PM everyday.

[PCEngineHell]

I kinda skipped back and forth on this abit,but to me,the VC is a nice idea,up until the actual price takes place. The only part I'd use it for is N64 titles because of how they have been with it so far,and maybe arcade games if they would actually do some arcade game emulation,and it was done correctly. Otherwise what I would rather see is them selling rom packs on a disc,that let you pull the games off the disc,transfer them to memory,and use them that way on VC.

I know this means your disc would then work on any one else's Wii,as the roms wouldn't be individualized for each system,but I mean hey,you paid for the game,you should be allowed to do with it as you please on whatever Wii you have access to. Maybe  a better way of doing it would have been the games being dl'ed straight to a memory card,and the VC only being able to access them from the card,not the system memory,and the memory manager being smart enough to not let you copy roms over to multiple cards. This way you could then access the rom on others systems,and if they are worried about copies,this would keep you from giving freebees away to friends who did not pay for the rom.

 I think there is going to be problems with this latter on in the systems future,when enough people realize they have paid to own a game that they have no real freedom of use with.Part of buying a piece of software is the fact you are supposed to be able to use it as you please. I think this even came into law in some aspect during game system reverse engineering trials in the late 80ies-early 90ies.

[Seldane]

There isn't much craziness about the Ys series, although Falcom is trying to become the next Capcom by releasing new identical super expensive (how does $100 sound?) and ultra short games every year.

Ys 1
Ys 2
Ys 3
Ys 4
Ys 4 PCE (non-canonical, but great nevertheless*)
Ys 5
2003 -Ys 6

OTHER STUFF

1998 - Ys ETERNAL (fantastic Ys 1 remake)
2000 - Ys II ETERNAL (fantastic Ys 2 remake)
2001 - Ys I - II COMPLETE (ever-so-slightly upgraded versions of Ys 1-2 Eternal, cheap of Falcom to re-release them like that, but that doesn't make the games any worse)
2005 - Ys: The Oath in Felghana (Ys 3 remake with super repetitive gameplay and poor level designs)
2006 - Ys Origin (prequel to Ys 1 with super repetitive gameplay and poor level designs)

Falcom sure is milking their old franchise, and are even making hardcore fans like myself steadily growing a certain dislike for the series.

*This text was actually going to be tiny, but I made a mistake and made it huge instead. Not changing it- it is more fun this way.

[Keranu]

The big text rulez!

[termis]

I actually only played Ys IV a few months ago, and while it was good, it somehow wasn't as satisfying as Ys I-II.  I thought the music was a notch below I-II (the TG version of course), and while everything was more polished, it just wasn't a huuuge improvement over the original 2.  I can only point to the cut scenes looking better, sprites seem to be more vibrant, but that's about it.  Had I not known, I really wouldn't be able to tell that this game came out 4-5 years after the original I-II.

Take the Phantasy Star series, there were clear and noticeable changes and/or improvements between I-IV (even the black sheep part III-not necessarily better, but different enough) - and I didn't see this so much with Ys IV.

Now that I think about it, yeah, I guess they were starting to milk the series at this point in time.  But strangely enough, I wouldn't mind playing part V sometime down the future, which doesn't look all that different still.

[GUTS]

Ys V is WAY different, try a rom out and you'll see.  I personally really liked it and even beat it when I imported it years ago, but many people can't stand it (kind of like Ys III, I love it but most Ys fans don't like it much).  I'm stoked that somebody is trying to translate V, I can't wait to play through it again in English.

[Keranu]

I want to play through Ys V sometime, just not sure when though. If the translated ROM comes out soon, I'll probably play it then.

[Seldane]

I wasn't talking about Ys V. I personally find it to be one of the finest games in the series.

But after Ys VI (which is nice), the Ys series has died for me. I almost can't stand Ys The Oath in Felghana and Ys Origin (the latter which I never even bothered to finish, I just uninstalled it after spending some incredibly boring hours with it), such obvious attempts at milking the series... with a very, VERY unmodern engine to boot (it was fairly impressive in 2003, but now it's just pathetic).

By the way - the Ys V translation will probably come out this march. Stay tuned!

[nat]

Ys V is WAY different, try a rom out and you'll see.  I personally really liked it and even beat it when I imported it years ago, but many people can't stand it (kind of like Ys III, I love it but most Ys fans don't like it much).  I'm stoked that somebody is trying to translate V, I can't wait to play through it again in English.

I've been playing Ys III a bit lately. I like it well enough, it's a bit different, but that's OK. Change is good sometimes. It's like Zelda II in that regard. The graphics are nice enough, but the thing that gets me is the god damn HORRIBLE scrolling. What the hell happened here? How could a game get released like this? If I were Hudson I'd be embarrassed to have my name on it. If I squint and pretend it's not there I like the game just fine. The music rocks.

[Seldane]

Nat: Ys III is a fun game, but the PCE version is simply unplayable. Get another version. ANY version.

[Joe Redifer]

I know Ys V had one good musical selection.  That was Super Duper Famicom only, correct?  Also why were the shitty versions of Ys 4 so different from the PCE version which was programmed by Jesus or Allah or someone holy?

[Seldane]

The only shitty Ys 4 version is the PS2 one. That is the worst game ever made in the history of time. Play it and die.

[Joe Redifer]

Well the PCE one is "The Dawn of teh Ys" and the SNES one is "Mask of teh Sun" and they are both different games yet feature similar music.  Are you telling me that the SNES version is worth it?

[GUTS]

SNES version is great, they just released a new english patch for it too so go play through it, its only like 8 hours long, I beat it in a couple nights.  It also has some awesome tie-ins with the other Ys games, and the ending is especially cool.  They did a really, really good job on the translation.

[ParanoiaDragon]

I personally find Mask of the Sun to be the worst of the series.  It's just the least fun.  I used to think of Ys 5 that way, but, it's grown on me.  As for Oath in Felghana & Origin, most Ys fans can't put them down because they're so damn good, but, I shouldn't have to explain that, I mean, we all know what an oddball Seldane is

[Seldane]

Well the PCE one is "The Dawn of teh Ys" and the SNES one is "Mask of teh Sun" and they are both different games yet feature similar music.  Are you telling me that the SNES version is worth it?

It most certainly is. Like GUTS said, it's a great game. Tons of fun, excellent gameplay, great music, etc etc. Definitely worth it, especially considering it is so very short.

[CrackTiger]

Personally, I wish more game serieses wouldn't try to change things so quickly. Or at least the good ones. Too many great games get sequals that have nothing to do with the original. At least Japan got the real SMB2(so did my hometown, but thats another story ).  I'm still waiting for a faithful sequal to Phantasy Star and an Ys style Ys III. 

Ys 3 in Ys style?  Look no further the Oath in Felghana, released in the summer of 06.  Beautiful game, beautiful music, & there's an english patch coming soon!  I can't praise the game enough, as it rules!  Though, I think now, Ys Origins is my favorite Ys.  Yeah, the 3 latest Ys aren't bump n' grind like 1, 2, & 4.  But, they're as close as you'll get to the original gameplay, while being being made in this day & age.  I HIGHLY recomend them!

I mean a real Ys style Ys III. Like 1, 2 & 4 PCE, not that 3D garbage. 

I just got the PS2 Ys III last night, I'm hoping its as faithful as its been made out to be. 

[GUTS]

Ys III PS2 looks like a fan game, which isn't bad, but there aren't any scrolling screens in the entire game, it plays like an MSX game.  The Genesis version is still the best by far.

[ParanoiaDragon]

Personally, I wish more game serieses wouldn't try to change things so quickly. Or at least the good ones. Too many great games get sequals that have nothing to do with the original. At least Japan got the real SMB2(so did my hometown, but thats another story ).  I'm still waiting for a faithful sequal to Phantasy Star and an Ys style Ys III. 

Ys 3 in Ys style?  Look no further the Oath in Felghana, released in the summer of 06.  Beautiful game, beautiful music, & there's an english patch coming soon!  I can't praise the game enough, as it rules!  Though, I think now, Ys Origins is my favorite Ys.  Yeah, the 3 latest Ys aren't bump n' grind like 1, 2, & 4.  But, they're as close as you'll get to the original gameplay, while being being made in this day & age.  I HIGHLY recomend them!

I mean a real Ys style Ys III. Like 1, 2 & 4 PCE, not that 3D garbage. 

I just got the PS2 Ys III last night, I'm hoping its as faithful as its been made out to be. 

3D?  Ark of Napishtim, Oath in Felghana, & Origin may use polygons, but, the games aren't 3D.  It's still a 2D series, just with updated graphics, & even the characters are 2D sprites, atleast, in the PC versions that is.  It's not like comparing the old Zelda's to Ocarina of Time, when it went 3D, cuz THAT's 3D.  I used to think the same thing, when Ark of Napishtim originally came out for PC years ago, so I wasn't interested in it.  But, when I heard it was announced for PS2, I started doing more research, & played a demo, & was very happy!  It feels like Ys on steroids, it's classic gameplay, minus the bump n' grind.  It's all old school, hence, one of the reasons they just don't do well in this world that's obsessed with 3D games.  People these days, atleast in the States, want games that are overly complicated, & 3D, & whatever.  Don't get me wrong, there are 2D games, that do well in the US, but, they're few & far between.  You should try out Oath in Felghana sometime, it's truly a thing of beauty, it rights, everything that was wrong with Ys 3(& I personally like Ys 3, but, Oath just plain rules!).

[Seldane]

I mean a real Ys style Ys III. Like 1, 2 & 4 PCE, not that 3D garbage. 

I just got the PS2 Ys III last night, I'm hoping its as faithful as its been made out to be. 

Word. I happen to like the original Ys 3 a lot though, and like GUTS said - especially the MD version.

Ys III PS2 is really nice, actually. Just keep far, far away from Ys 4 and 5 on that system.

You're doing good - keep keeping away from YsF and you'll be a happy man!

[ParanoiaDragon]

I mean a real Ys style Ys III. Like 1, 2 & 4 PCE, not that 3D garbage. 

I just got the PS2 Ys III last night, I'm hoping its as faithful as its been made out to be. 

Word. I happen to like the original Ys 3 a lot though, and like GUTS said - especially the MD version.

Ys III PS2 is really nice, actually. Just keep far, far away from Ys 4 and 5 on that system.

You're not doing good - if you keep keeping away from YsF,  you'll be a VERY unhappy man!

Like Seldane said, you'll be pretty unhappy if you stay away from YsF.   Frankly, it's way better then Ark of Napishtim.  Not to say Ark is bad, it's just kind of boring in comparison to Felghana & Origin.

[Keranu]

I say the only Ys you'll ever need to play is I & II. There are some other nice games in the series, but I & II is epic.

[termis]

^^ Agreed. 

Though I do think III and IV are worth the playing time, playing I & II for the first time was just a damn fine experience that the sequels never matched.

[ParanoiaDragon]

I say the only Ys you'll ever need to play is I & II. There are some other nice games in the series, but I & II is epic.

Ofcoarse, that's coming from someone who's never played the new games

[Keranu]

I say the only Ys you'll ever need to play is I & II. There are some other nice games in the series, but I & II is epic.

Ofcoarse, that's coming from someone who's never played the new games

True (with the exception of Ys VI), but it's hard for any game to have the same experience as I & II. I look forward to eventually playing Oath in Felghana and Origin in the future, just not sure when I'll get around to that.