RPGs In English

[Monster Bonce]

Does anyone know of a complete list of TGCD RPGs? I have a PCE Duo so I can't play US HuCards but I'd still like to track down some CD games.

[Seldane]

Cosmic Fantasy 2
The Legend of Heroes
Dungeon Master
Might & Magic III

That's it.

[Monster Bonce]

That's grim. What about Ys Books I & II and Ys III? If they don't count then I'm being unclear - it's those kinds of games I want. I'm currently playing Ys I & II in Japanese but would prefer to get it in English.

[Seldane]

Oh, I thought you meant RPGs.

[RuninRuder]

For action-RPGs, you've got Ys I & II, Ys III, Dungeon Explorer II, Exile, Exile II, and if you stretch the boundaries of the genre, Shape Shifter.

[Monster Bonce]

My bad, I wasn't clear. Both kinds are fine by me. I'm struggling with Out Live and Necromancer looks like it would be pretty grim even if I could understand it.

Stretch how far? Stretch as far as Dragon's Curse or not quite that far?

[RuninRuder]

Yeah, it's a side-scrolling hack-and-slash quest game.  Take Legendary Axe and make it into a Simon's Quest style game, and that's basically what Shape Shifter's like.

[Keranu]

Seldane forgot Order of the Griffin.

[Nazi NecroPhile]

Seldane forgot Order of the Griffin.

No he didn't, that's a HuCard and M.B. wanted disc only games.

[Keranu]

Whoops, my bad!

Though actually was it possible to play Order of the Griffin on a Japanese system or was that Night Creatures of all games?

[Nazi NecroPhile]

I don't recall, but whichever it was I believe still required a converter but didn't require the grounded pin.

[kenomac78]

i always considred beyond shadowgate to be an RPG, unless you come from the school of though that RPS must have hit points.i am not. with that you can add loom to the list. and some others

[Seldane]

Beyond Shadowgate does not contain a single RPG element. Even FIFA '07 is more of an RPG.

[Monster Bonce]

I had Shadowgate on the Mac and, waaaayyy back, on the Atari ST. How does the TG version differ?

Edit: I agree with Seldane, it's not an RPG, it's an adventure game. I suppose it's an RPG in the sense that every game has you playing a role. Still, I'm not complaining, I like adventure games.

[Keranu]

Technically practically any game can be a RPG since you role play in them.

[VestCunt]

The four FM listed are the only "true" turn-based RPGs.  I have a pretty damn loose interpretation of "RPG" that includes all the games everyone else listed as well as Loom.
Some of these games belong in other genres, but if you're an RPG lover, they'll satisfy you to some degree:

Beyond Shadowgate
Cosmic Fantasy 2 (too many battles)
Dragon Slayer
Dungeon Explorer 2
Dungeon Master
Dynastic Hero (more of an adventure game)
Exile (too easy)
Exile 2 (very hard)
Loom
Might and Magic 3
Shape Shifter (a lot like Cadash)
Ys 1-2
Ys 3

That's 13 games out of the 45 CDs, or 28% of the US releases that are Adventure/RPGs.  Even if you only count the four turn-based RPGs, that's still 8% of the library and probably on par with, or better than, other consoles for its time.  The TG-CD also has four mystery games (Sherlock 1+2, JB Harold, It Came from the Desert) and two strategy games (Vasteel, Lords ot Rising Sun) that may appeal to thoughtful, problem-solving gamers.

Now for a completely irrelevant rant...
Why the hell do games have to look like Chrono Trigger or take place in a medieval setting to be considered RPGs.  Take the original Metal Gear on the NES for example--totally an RPG.  Why doesn't anyone considered it an RPG?  Because it was created when RPGs were barely even a genre and because it doesn't look like stinkin' Final Fantasy-cutesy-village-crap.  Instead of a village you have rescued hostages and a radio; you collect keys (key cards), weapons, and healing potions (rations); explore dungeons (fortresses); and even gain levels (rank).  Heck, the stealthy box might as well be an invisibility spell.  It's an RPG, damnit.

[Joe Redifer]

My definition for RPG consists of the following:

-Fight
-Level up
-Fight
-Buy shit to equip and heal
-Fight
-Learn and use magic/techniques
-Fight
-Fight
-Walk...
-Fight
-Fight
-Talk to people
-Fight
-Fight
-Save and load your game
-Fight
-Fight

If a game has all of those things, it's an RPG to me.

[guyjin]

Define 'level up'. Ferinstance, if you count gaining heart containers and the color rings from the original Legend of Zelda, it's an RPG.

[OldRover]

I would probably consider Metal Gear an RPG of sorts, more of a hybrid genre type game. You can combine an RPG with just about any other genre or subgenre of game and come up with a nice hybrid (Final Lap Twin [driving RPG], Dark Savior [VS fighting RPG], Dark Wizard [nonstandard strategy RPG], etc).

[Joe Redifer]

Leveling up to me means after you've gotten in so many fights your strength and life increases.  In Zelda you just find a new heart in a treasure box if I recall (same with Monster World/Dragon's Curse) but your attack power and defense power do not raise simultaneously.

[Seldane]

Keranu: you're wrong. People often believe that's the case, but an RPG is not a game where you take the role of a character. It is a game based on old tabletop RPG mechanics, and therefore REQUIRE the following to happen, in order to be called an RPG.

-Fight
-Level up
-Fight
-Buy shit to equip and heal
-Fight
-Learn and use magic/techniques
-Fight
-Fight
-Walk...
-Fight
-Fight
-Talk to people
-Fight
-Fight
-Save and load your game
-Fight
-Fight

Again, FIFA is more like an RPG than Beyond Shadowgate and stuff that people mentioned in this thread.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Console_role-playing_game
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Computer_role-playing_game

Vestcunt: Why are you using the RPG term loosely? Why not replace it with adventure? At least that would make sense.

Beyond Shadowgate - adventure
Dungeon Explorer 2 - adventure
Dynastic Hero (more of an adventure game) - adventure
Exile (too easy) - adventure
Exile 2 (very hard) - adventure
Shape Shifter (a lot like Cadash) - adventure

And what's up with that percentage nonsense? 8% RPGs is better than other systems? What system exactly? The Pippin? Let's say only one game got released for the TG and it was an RPG. 100% of its game library would consist of RPGs. Would that make it the best RPG console ever? No. More like the worst. For English RPGs, the TG is not a very good system, as pretty much any console (except the Pippin) offers many many more (and definitely better) RPGs.

[greedostick]

Dynastic Hero and Dragons Curse are action rpg's. There is also a y's 4 translation. Although that game was not released in english. The game however is fully translated.

[TurboXray]

Dynastic Hero and Dragons Curse are action rpg's. There is also a y's 4 translation. Although that game was not released in english. The game however is fully translated.

If you're counting Ys4, then add Xak III as it's been fully translated by the same guys.

[guyjin]

And what's up with that percentage nonsense? 8% RPGs is better than other systems? What system exactly? The Pippin? Let's say only one game got released for the TG and it was an RPG. 100% of its game library would consist of RPGs. Would that make it the best RPG console ever? No. More like the worst. For English RPGs, the TG is not a very good system, as pretty much any console (except the Pippin) offers many many more (and definitely better) RPGs.

I would put CF2 up against anything on the SNES.

[jimid2]

I would put CF2 up against anything on the SNES.

...and it would be soundly trounced by Final Fantasy II/IV and FF III/VI - especially Final Fantasy VI. 

[OldRover]

Exile and Exile II are platform/RPG hybrid games. All the standard elements of the classic RPG are present.

[Nazi NecroPhile]

Keranu: you're wrong. People often believe that's the case, but an RPG is not a game where you take the role of a character. It is a game based on old tabletop RPG mechanics....

If you're gonna get that strict with your RPG definition, then I submit that there are no video game RPGs.  If you ain't rollin' a thirty eight sided die, it ain't a Role Playing Game. 

Now don't get all worked up - I actually agree with most of your assessment, except why don't the Exile pair qualify as RPGs (like Nod noted)?  I distinctly remember doing all of the following while playing.

-Fight
-Level up
-Fight
-Buy shit to equip and heal
-Fight
-Learn and use magic/techniques
-Fight
-Fight
-Walk...
-Fight
-Fight
-Talk to people
-Fight
-Fight
-Save and load your game
-Fight
-Fight

I would put CF2 up against anything on the SNES.

...and it would be soundly trounced by Final Fantasy II/IV and FF III/VI - especially Final Fantasy VI. 

The story line of CF2 is equal to any of Final Fantasy, but everything else is a little worse.

I prefer an altogether different type of RPG when the neighbors get a little out of hand.  A well aimed AT4 shuts 'em up quite nicely. 

[OldRover]

The storyline of CF2 easily trounces virtually anything Squaresoft made on their own. I was hoping for an improvement in storyline capability with the acquisition of the RPG storyline masters, Enix, but it didn't happen. Oh well.

[RuninRuder]

The story and characters in CF2 absolutely annihilate anything that can be found in the SNES "masterpieces."  I also think CF2 has great enemy art and I really dig its music, though I wish it had more tunes. 

The only thing that some SNES RPGs have over it are better or more interesting battle systems.  But those battle systems feel outdated at this point, considering what came later in PSX and PS2 RPGs.  On the other hand, CF2's strengths, its story and characters, still hold their own to this day.

[OldRover]

The story and characters in CF2 absolutely annihilate anything that can be found in the SNES "masterpieces."  I also think CF2 has great enemy art and I really dig its music, though I wish it had more tunes. 

The only thing that some SNES RPGs have over it are better or more interesting battle systems.  But those battle systems feel outdated at this point, considering what came later in PSX and PS2 RPGs.  On the other hand, CF2's strengths, its story and characters, still hold their own to this day. 

CF2 and Illusion Of Gaia are pretty on-par in terms of storyline power and cohesion. IOG lacks in character development though, giving CF2 the easy win in the storyline department, but IOG has some really memorable musical moments. The rest of the SNES RPGs don't hold a candle to CF2 in the storyline or character department. CF2's music is really nice, but the track selection is so limited because all of the game's normal soundtracks are kept in one track to minimize reseek time, and the disc itself is positively stuffed with audio and data. I don't think there was room for any more music.

A remake of the entire Cosmic Fantasy series on the PC would be excellent. I'd take on such a project.

[GUTS]

I don't know, I think Chrono Trigger and FFVI both have great battle systems that still hold up well, especially Chrono.  Fighting in Chrono is actually fun in my opinion, where in a lot of RPGs it just gets to be a drag after a while.

[Seldane]

I agree. After having played through Chrono Trigger, I can't really enjoy ANY other RPG... that battle system was just so perfect. I wish more games were just like it.

[Keranu]

I somewhat agree with runin about SNES RPGs have more interesting and possibly better battle systems, but I've learned to like simplistic old skool battle systems like that of CF2. I remember I was playing around with my brother's game of Final Fantasy X after playing some CF2 and FFX's battle system just threw me off so much with all of it's options that it just wasn't fun to me. It's always fun to see new ways developers make battle systems, but I think in the end it's best to have a nice, quick standard system. I really like a game like Dragon Slayer though where you can quickly get through enemy battles, but have nice strategic bosses.

[Joe Redifer]

Ys IV wasn't fully translated since the voices still play in Japanese.  And there are A LOT of voices in that game.

Chrono Trigger's battles feel loose and disjointed to me (I'm playing through the game now).  I often don't know what is going on because shit keeps happening as I'm trying to choose a command.  There are two different ways to set up the battles, WAIT and NORMAL (or something like that) in the options screen.  I've tried both and they both are exactly the same.

[greedostick]

Wait should mean that the enemies will not attac until you have chosen your command. Normal means if you sit there they will keep attacking you.

[Joe Redifer]

Yeah I have it on WAIT and they keep attacking me as I go through the menus.  I put it on WAIT hoping it would be like other menu-driven RPG battles.  They "fixed" something that wasn't broken.  Well actually they broke something that was working properly already.

[SNKNostalgia]

To be more precise on the Wait and Active system: Once the time meters are full, the enemy can't attack you when just sitting there on the menu screen with Wait mode. Chrono Trigger really isn't all that hard. It never really bothered me, plus it helped me memorize the order of techiniques and items.

Also, you guys are forgetting one of the best RPG series especially when it comes to story.... Lunar 1 and Lunar 2 for Sega CD. Those games are just simply awesome. The remakes make it even nicer even though I still like the original with its NEC style animation sequences instead of FMV.

I am a little baffled how one would prefer Cosmic Fantasy 2 over games like FF6, but oh well.

[Seldane]

The active and wait systems are identical in Chrono Trigger. Must be a bug. There's absolutely no difference regardless of what you choose. I always use the wait system, and yet- the enemies WILL kill all my dudes if I just leave the controller and do something else during a battle.

[Joe Redifer]

How DARE you say Chrono Trigger has a bug.  You do realize that SNERDs will come to your house and kill you, right?

Anyway Lunar 1 and 2 are both good, but I really preferred part 2.  Playing through part 1 first is a must, though.

And I've always been fond of the real Phantasy Star games (the Online ones are bullshit and don't count for anything).

[OldRover]

Lunar: The Silver Star is definitely an excellent RPG. Eternal Blue wasn't quite as good, IMO, and although the storylines were expanded for the Playstation remakes, the gameplay really suffered. I'd rather play The Silver Star than Silver Star Story...it's one of those cases where the storyline changes don't justify the horribly broken gameplay. And forget about the Eternal Blue remake...what a load of shit that was. I returned the damn thing to the store, and told them that it was broken (technically, it is!).

Chrono Trigger is so full of bugs that I could never enjoy it. It wasn't enough that it had a broken battle system, but then you've got a storyline that's so full of holes you'd think it was a screen door. But hey, that's Square's style, go figure.

[Joe Redifer]

Like I've said elsewhere, I'm still not sure what Chrono Trigger is about.

[SNKNostalgia]

The active and wait systems are identical in Chrono Trigger. Must be a bug. There's absolutely no difference regardless of what you choose. I always use the wait system, and yet- the enemies WILL kill all my dudes if I just leave the controller and do something else during a battle.

Now, is this when you just leave the controller alone and then the meters fill up and that is it? Or is it when you are actually in the menu selecting magics or items? Try again and you might see how it works.

[ParanoiaDragon]

Lunar: The Silver Star is definitely an excellent RPG. Eternal Blue wasn't quite as good, IMO, and although the storylines were expanded for the Playstation remakes, the gameplay really suffered. I'd rather play The Silver Star than Silver Star Story...it's one of those cases where the storyline changes don't justify the horribly broken gameplay. And forget about the Eternal Blue remake...what a load of shit that was. I returned the damn thing to the store, and told them that it was broken (technically, it is!).

Chrono Trigger is so full of bugs that I could never enjoy it. It wasn't enough that it had a broken battle system, but then you've got a storyline that's so full of holes you'd think it was a screen door. But hey, that's Square's style, go figure.

Sorry Nod, but, I didn't get to play either Lunar until the PS1 ports, & they immediatly became one of my favorite RPG series, along with Ys, Suikoden, & I guess I could say Wild Arms(though, I own all the games, I've only beaten the original version of 1).  I have the Sega CD versions of the Lunar's......&, I just don't like them as much.  Go figure.

[SNKNostalgia]

I didn't really see any problems with the PS1 ports. Other than maybe the not so great line glitching at the top of the screen when scrolling compared to the Saturn versions, but no big ass deal. It is different in the sense of the battles, but I never saw anything to make the game worse in any way. It does seem like the PS1 games are harder if I remember correctly. It has been 5 years since I played the Sega CD versions. Hell, it has been 3 years since I played the PS1 versions until the past 2 months. I did play the Sega CD versions first back in like 97 and had a blast with the story and feel of the games. I just recently broke out some games like Dark Wizard, Vay and even Sword of Vermillion which is hard as shit to me right now.

[GUTS]

The Lunar games on PSX aren't as bad as some people make them out, but the Sega CD versions are definitely better by quite a bit.  They just changed too much of the story lines in the remakes and they lost a lot of what made them so great in the first place.  They're still enjoyable RPGs if you haven't played the Sega CD versions.

[Joe Redifer]

Now I'm wandering through 65 billion BC on Chrono Trigger.  I'm not stuck or anything, I'm just bored.  The music is complete ass in this era (if you can even call it music), the graphics are horrible and it's just not fun at all.  My desire to continue playing the game is decreasing rapidly.

[greedostick]

I also like both of the Lunar games alot. Even though I have never finished 2, but played through it halfway about 10 times. I have also been very fond of the Phantasy star games. Maybe cause III was the first genesis rpg I ever played. Most people don't like 3 but I always thought it was quite good. I have always like Shining in the darkenss and Holy Ark alot even though they are dungeon crawlers.

My true love are action rpg's though. Love all the wonder boy games. Especially Dynastic Hero. Faxanadu for nes, secret of mana II or seiken densetsu III. My favorite game of all time is still Landstalker: The Treasures of King Knole for the Genesis. The game is just awesome in every way once you get use to the 3-D isometric view. Kicks zeldas ass in every way. Better graphics, music, and has alot better story then the 8 and 16 bit versions of the Zelda games.

[Seldane]

Now I'm wandering through 65 billion BC on Chrono Trigger.  I'm not stuck or anything, I'm just bored.  The music is complete ass in this era (if you can even call it music), the graphics are horrible and it's just not fun at all.  My desire to continue playing the game is decreasing rapidly.

Seems like the general opinion on this game is that it gets a LOT better after about 10 hours of playtime. I agree with that statement. The jungle is boring and ugly.

greedostick: Every game you mentioned ROCKS!! Awesome games, expecially Landstalker.

I've only played Lunar 1 for GBA. I assume it is the same game as the MCD one, sans the fmvs (they consist of pictures with text instead). I enjoyed the second (MCD) game more, but never actually found much enjoyment in either of those games.

[offsidewing]

How come the battle system in the Turbo release of Dragon Slayer doesn't get more props for circa 1992??

It was also a good first step in specializing weapons (some characters suffer AP if you equip them with the "Lion Blade" instead of the "Lion Lance.")  It was also a great way to recycle weapons in your group when you found better ones in dungeons.  The option to switch from PSG to CD music is not without it's charm.

While the story line from CF2 makes it tops in my book, I don't think people give Dragon Slayer a fair shake down 15 years later.

[kenomac78]

gettng back to the discussion of what makes an RPG i always considered RPGs as any game where the character is customaizeable and the characters can choose different choices and that determines the outcome of the game. 

of course that was what  i adopted in about 1989.

now games are alot different.  if anything grand theft auto 3 and zelda twilight princess are equal amounts RPG as they play out in the same way.  but now games are so big and customizeable that defintion cant work anymore