Vasteel static dubbing or something worse?

tf2macross · 03/16/2011, 09:55 PM

I've been a long time turbo fan and the owner of a recent bought duo-rx. I just got my copy of vasteel and the voice dubbing is just horrible (and I'm not referring to the script/voice actors). The actual music during the strategy session is ok, but during the intro with the english dub story has way too much static and distortion. Does anyone know if this is just the way the game was made with a bad quality transfer? I can't believe how bad the distortion is and how it got released like this.

I've played audio music cd's, macross 2036, and some other import cd games and the system is not experiencing this problem so I doubt it's the caps.

Thanks.

Arkhan Asylum · 03/16/2011, 10:16 PM

You got a bad copy, my voices are fine....

try other games using ADPCM samples, like maybe my Insanity demo. its at www.aetherbyte.com

See if the sfx in that go apeshit.

tf2macross · 03/16/2011, 11:20 PM

Never suspected the copy would be bad.

VestCunt · 03/17/2011, 12:31 AM

It's been a long time, but I remember there being little audio explanations of the various units that were terribly compressed.

SignOfZeta · 03/17/2011, 12:43 AM

I don't have this game, but streaming ADPCM sound is pretty horrible on almost any game.

spenoza · 03/17/2011, 01:33 AM

Vasteel has a heck of a lot of speech in it and most of it is very, very compressed and sounds minimally intelligible at best.

CrackTiger · 03/17/2011, 03:22 AM

I had a PCE CD-ROM that started playing adpcm sound all staticy (like track 2 on a PCE CD) and I've heard of it happening to a few other systems (including a Duo) over the years. I would try other games with streaming and samples of adpcm. It stood out most for me with Dracula X since all the sfx are adpcm samples.

Vasteel does have low quality sound for the dialogue by PCE streaming adpcm standards.

DragonmasterDan · 03/17/2011, 07:00 AM

I don't remember it being poorly compressed, but I do remember the delivery being awful. Easily the worst Working Designs dub ever.

esteban · 03/17/2011, 07:06 AM

I suppose we should explain that in order to squeeze all that dialogue (+Red Book soundtrack) on the CD, a compromise in audio quality was made. The Red Book music alone eats up a lot of space...

Which reminds me: some of the short voice sample in Ys Book I & II (when you meet Goban, for example), are painfully compressed and sound stinky. This admittedly minor compromise still bugs me, even after all these years.

I suppose that makes me a sad person.

Arkhan Asylum · 03/17/2011, 06:12 PM

Quote from: tf2macross on 03/16/2011, 11:20 PMNever suspected the copy would be bad.

I dont know why I said bad copy, I wasnt awake.

I meant you might have a doofed up system.

Do you mean the dialogue in the cutscenes?

Maybe capture what you mean and upload so we know exactly what you are talking about. The talking on the game from what I hear is dopey voice acting, but isnt garbly.

Joe Redifer · 03/17/2011, 07:20 PM

I doubt his system or his copy are bad. He is hearing the digital noise that comes along with compressing voices through that harsh chip. You hear it a lot in Ys 1, 2 and 3 as well (when CD audio is not being used for the voices). The chip is very noisy. That's just the way the thing is. Some games are worse than others in this regard.

spenoza · 03/18/2011, 01:22 AM

It isn't the chip, per se. Short sounds play without too much noise. It's simply what happens when you use low quality audio compression. The PCE needs low-bandwidth, low CPU compression for sound clips longer than, oh, sound-effect short, which means low quality results. It's below mono, 8-bit, 11 khz. Lower quality than what an analog phone line transmits.

TurboXray · 03/18/2011, 10:58 AM

The ADPCM chip in the CD unit has nothing do with the CPU for playback. It plays back (AD) PCM by itself from it's own ram. It also streams from the CD to it's ram without cpu help (although the cpu flips the ADPCM ram pointer every few seconds from a system card interrupt call). The digital artifacts from the compression can be greater or worse depending on the sample playback speed (8khz or 16khz) and even preprocessing of the stream before converting to ADPCM. I think this is one case where they should have added a filter to the ADPCM output. I would if you could make a decent enough one yourself (system mod).

SaturdayMorningRobots · 03/18/2011, 11:46 AM

I haven't had the english version of that game for like 14 years (Why oh why did I sell all those Working designs games!?!) But I do vaguely remember the compressed speech sounding pretty damn sketchy. I don't think you have anything wrong.

Anyway The cut scenes in Vasteel are some of the least interesting on the duo and a bit boring anyway Just skip em and enjoy an otherwise awesome game.

spenoza · 03/18/2011, 02:23 PM

Quote from: TurboXray on 03/18/2011, 10:58 AMThe ADPCM chip in the CD unit has nothing do with the CPU for playback. It plays back (AD) PCM by itself from it's own ram. It also streams from the CD to it's ram without cpu help (although the cpu flips the ADPCM ram pointer every few seconds from a system card interrupt call). The digital artifacts from the compression can be greater or worse depending on the sample playback speed (8khz or 16khz) and even preprocessing of the stream before converting to ADPCM. I think this is one case where they should have added a filter to the ADPCM output. I would if you could make a decent enough one yourself (system mod).

What I meant by low CPU compression was simply audio quality reduction methods rather than encoded stuff like MP3. The ADPCM chip cannot really use advanced encoding methods to reduce the data stream but preserve quality.

Arkhan Asylum · 03/19/2011, 07:22 PM

This is strange, I play mine and don't really see a problem, lol.

maybe I am going deaf, or need to crank the volume way the hell up.

Or I'm used to it and don't see it as "bad" from hearing all kinds of worse digitization on lesser machines.

ParanoiaDragon · 03/19/2011, 09:40 PM

Offhand, I recall this, It Came From the Desert & Ys 3 have some of the worst sounding compression in a Turbo game.

SignOfZeta · 03/19/2011, 11:31 PM

I think TG-16-only players probably notice it more since audio in general is less common on US releases and the more "multi-media" stuff got skipped. When you do hear it, it will stand out.

PCE games tend to be more voice heavy and this sort of shitty audio is super common so its not anything special. Its used in many many cinemas to save disc space. Many PCE RPGs, digital comics, etc have more audio than you can fit on a standard audio CD so it was either this or go to multiple discs (which, for some reason, was never done on PCE).

Mathius · 03/20/2011, 02:33 AM

Quote from: SignOfZeta on 03/19/2011, 11:31 PMI think TG-16-only players probably notice it more since audio in general is less common on US releases and the more "multi-media" stuff got skipped. When you do hear it, it will stand out.

PCE games tend to be more voice heavy and this sort of shitty audio is super common so its not anything special. Its used in many many cinemas to save disc space. Many PCE RPGs, digital comics, etc have more audio than you can fit on a standard audio CD so it was either this or go to multiple discs (which, for some reason, was never done on PCE).

Yeah, I never understood why we never got an epic multi-disc adventure on the PCE. Seems like a missed opportunity.

Arkhan Asylum · 03/20/2011, 01:46 PM

Quote from: Mathius on 03/20/2011, 02:33 AM
Quote from: SignOfZeta on 03/19/2011, 11:31 PMI think TG-16-only players probably notice it more since audio in general is less common on US releases and the more "multi-media" stuff got skipped. When you do hear it, it will stand out.

PCE games tend to be more voice heavy and this sort of shitty audio is super common so its not anything special. Its used in many many cinemas to save disc space. Many PCE RPGs, digital comics, etc have more audio than you can fit on a standard audio CD so it was either this or go to multiple discs (which, for some reason, was never done on PCE).
Yeah, I never understood why we never got an epic multi-disc adventure on the PCE. Seems like a missed opportunity.

I think back then, the concept was just not thought of. Things were still in a cartridge style thought process for consoles. PC Games had multiple discs (World of Xeen!), but consoles were like turn it on, and play! DONT TOUCH STUFF.

I bet alot of developers once they saw FFVII and stuff went *facepalm* DAMMIT. WE COULD HAVE DONE THAT LIKE 10 YEARS AGO.

DragonmasterDan · 03/20/2011, 04:32 PM

Quote from: guest on 03/20/2011, 01:46 PMI think back then, the concept was just not thought of. Things were still in a cartridge style thought process for consoles. PC Games had multiple discs (World of Xeen!), but consoles were like turn it on, and play! DONT TOUCH STUFF.

I bet alot of developers once they saw FFVII and stuff went *facepalm* DAMMIT. WE COULD HAVE DONE THAT LIKE 10 YEARS AGO.

Theoretically Cosmic Fantasy 4 is two discs, they just happened to be sold separately

In any event it was being done on other platforms (Sega CD had multi-disc games, though mostly FMV garbage) so it's not like it was completely out of sight and out of mind.

OldRover · 03/22/2011, 11:37 AM

Quote from: Mathius on 03/20/2011, 02:33 AMYeah, I never understood why we never got an epic multi-disc adventure on the PCE. Seems like a missed opportunity.

We will soon... hint hint.

Mathius · 03/22/2011, 01:05 PM

Quote from: OldRover on 03/22/2011, 11:37 AM
Quote from: Mathius on 03/20/2011, 02:33 AMYeah, I never understood why we never got an epic multi-disc adventure on the PCE. Seems like a missed opportunity.
We will soon... hint hint.

Groovy

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Vasteel static dubbing or something worse?