Ranger X vs Cybernator

[VenomMacbeth]

I was originally gonna make this a three-option thing, but there aren't any mech games on PCE Hucard format that can hold a candle to either of these games, in my opinion.  Veigues is great, but it's a completely different kind of game. 

I picked these games because they are, I believe, the best giant robit games on their respective consoles that I own (otherwise, Metal Warriors would have likely taken the #1 spot on the SNES.) 

Before I say anything about either of the games, I'd like to hear some of your opinions.

[PCEngineHell]

I liked Cybernator more then Metal Warriors. Ranger X was fun, but I liked Cybernator's stages, graphics, and sound more.

[CrackTiger]

I was originally gonna make this a three-option thing, but there aren't any mech games on PCE Hucard format that can hold a candle to either of these games, in my opinion.  Veigues is great, but it's a completely different kind of game. 

Blood gear is a better mech game than those two, but it is also a different (more mech-like) kind of game.

Why only look to the HuCard format?

[SignOfZeta]

Blood Gear is bad to the bone, but the action side of things takes a serious back seat to the RPG element that these other two games don't even really have.

I voted for Cybernator. I love the entire Assault Suit series but honestly the SFC version is my favorite. The way to mech moves is just so cool. I also prefer it to Metal Warriors.

[CrackTiger]

Blood Gear is bad to the bone, but the action side of things takes a serious back seat to the RPG element that these other two games don't even really have.

I voted for Cybernator. I love the entire Assault Suit series but honestly the SFC version is my favorite. The way to mech moves is just so cool. I also prefer it to Metal Warriors.

That's what I appreciate about it and makes it feel like more of a mech game. The battling and maneuvering is more methodic. The other games are more regular action games, especially Ranger X. But that's also what's so endearing about the Valken games, they really feel more like a side scrolling mech sim than a regular game with a mecha sprite used for the main character.

[Joe Redifer]

Shouldn't it be Target Earth vs Cybernator? Ranger X is kind of it's own thing but Target Earth and Cybernator are part of the same series. Both are awesome but I haven't played Cybernator in depth yet. Target Earth makes most gamers cry because of its difficulty, though.

[VenomMacbeth]

Shouldn't it be Target Earth vs Cybernator? Ranger X is kind of it's own thing but Target Earth and Cybernator are part of the same series. Both are awesome but I haven't played Cybernator in depth yet. Target Earth makes most gamers cry because of its difficulty, though.

Yeah, I considered that, but Target Earth does nothing particularly impressive.  The music is meh, the game is far too difficult, and the graphics...well, I'm pretty sure the master system could have handled this game.  Hell, the character sprite doesn't even match the Leynos artwork.  Don't get me wrong, I like Target Earth, but I'm afraid it just doesn't really measure up to either Ranger-X or Cybernator.

[Tatsujin]

not cybernator but assault suit valken wins the battle by a landside. probably one of the best and also most underrated games on the SFC.

[VenomMacbeth]

not cybernator but assault suit valken wins the battle by a landside. probably one of the best and also most underrated games on the SFC.

Very true.  Hence why I used Cybernator instead; there really is no contest, otherwise.

[majors]

... but Target Earth does nothing particularly impressive. 

If this was a Sega forum, I'd go ballistic hate reply on you. But since it's not, I'll just agree to disagree on Target Earth. I love that game! I also have Ranger X in the collection so I feel I have an informed view. I have made hate for SNES, so no Cybernator (I have played it tho) so my vote is for X.

What about Spriggan Mark 2? It has some of the Ranger X feel...but of course, forced scrolling.

[EvilEvoIX]

Ranger X is Amazing....  Go play it and tell me it isn't.

[SignOfZeta]

... but Target Earth does nothing particularly impressive. 

If this was a Sega forum, I'd go ballistic hate reply on you. But since it's not, I'll just agree to disagree on Target Earth. I love that game! I also have Ranger X in the collection so I feel I have an informed view. I have made hate for SNES, so no Cybernator (I have played it tho) so my vote is for X.

What about Spriggan Mark 2? It has some of the Ranger X feel...but of course, forced scrolling.

I like Target Earth too, but its pretty crude. The graphics kind of suck and the difficulty is just stupid. Even back in the day, before 20 years of easy games pussified me, I thought it was too fucking hard. %99 of the people who bought it can't even clear the first stage.

Spriggan Mk II is also amazing, but its not quintessentially a "mech" game. Those sprites could be replaced with fairies or psychic kids or boats and it wouldn't make any difference.

Cybernator/Valken is different though. Rather that just being a re-skinned Mario game it feels like you are controlling a mech. It has weight to it. You can see the leg suspension compress when it lands. It ejects shells. It squashes foot soldiers. The guys that made this game were huge mecha nerds obviously inspired by Votoms, MADDOX, etc and they put all that nerdery into this game.

[CrackTiger]

I rented Target Earth when it first came out and for a while, my friend and I couldn't figure out how to beat the first stage. But as with many other games that I couldn't crack at first, once I figured out how to play the game as intended, I finished it without dying the first time I cleared the first stage.

[turbokon]

I currently have both games, however haven't really played both much. I've played thru the first stage on ranger x and haven't really touch cybernator since back in the days. Based on my limited experiences with the two games, I would say ranger x for the visual alone.

[geise]

Shouldn't it be Target Earth vs Cybernator? Ranger X is kind of it's own thing but Target Earth and Cybernator are part of the same series. Both are awesome but I haven't played Cybernator in depth yet. Target Earth makes most gamers cry because of its difficulty, though.

Yeah, I considered that, but Target Earth does nothing particularly impressive.  The music is meh, the game is far too difficult, and the graphics...well, I'm pretty sure the master system could have handled this game.  Hell, the character sprite doesn't even match the Leynos artwork.  Don't get me wrong, I like Target Earth, but I'm afraid it just doesn't really measure up to either Ranger-X or Cybernator. 

The music in Target Earth blows away Ranger-X.

[Joe Redifer]

Yeah, I considered that, but Target Earth does nothing particularly impressive.  The music is meh, the game is far too difficult, and the graphics...well, I'm pretty sure the master system could have handled this game.  Hell, the character sprite doesn't even match the Leynos artwork.  Don't get me wrong, I like Target Earth, but I'm afraid it just doesn't really measure up to either Ranger-X or Cybernator. 

Target Earth music is great. I agree with Geise (sorry for capitalizing your name) it's better than Ranger X's music. The Master System can't do omni-directional parallax scrolling. I can't imagine someone not being able to get past the first stage. I got way far in the game when I bought it without any game genies or save states. I may have even beaten it, I'd have to check my notes if I could only find them (yes I kept track of that stuf). Cybernator may indeed be the better game, but Target Earth is still awesome.

[VenomMacbeth]

Target Earth music is great. I agree with Geise (sorry for capitalizing your name) it's better than Ranger X's music. The Master System can't do omni-directional parallax scrolling. I can't imagine someone not being able to get past the first stage. I got way far in the game when I bought it without any game genies or save states. I may have even beaten it, I'd have to check my notes if I could only find them (yes I kept track of that stuf). Cybernator may indeed be the better game, but Target Earth is still awesome.

Parallax scrolling does not good graphics make.  Sure, the SMS couldn't handle that, but the game's graphics are pretty simple otherwise.  I'd rather see detailed graphics that take advantage of the Genesis' color pallet, or at least look artistically inspired than graphical gimmicks (even though I do love me some good parallax scrolling.) I do like Target Earth, I just feel it's a huge letdown when you compare it not only Cybernator, but other Genesis games.  As far as the music goes, there are some tracks I like (particularly the ending theme) but the compositions are soured for me by the somewhat obnoxious tones they used.  Ranger X may not have the greatest soundtrack, but at least it's unobtrusive & fitting for the game.  I especially like the jungle stage music.

 It seems like I'm hating on it a lot, but despite all I said, I do enjoy Target Earth even if for no other reason it's an Assault Suits game.  I probably just need to give it a better chance; that's what happened with Ranger X.  I've had that game since I began collecting for the Genesis & I only just now got around to getting anywhere with it & truly appreciating it.

[SignOfZeta]

Its not that Target Earth is shitty or anything, its just that Cybernator is fucking great. I'm a huge fan of NCS/Masaya but I'm the first to admit that most of their games are pretty damned flawed. The first Assault Suit game is more in line with Macross 2036, Langrisser, etc and Cybernator is way beyond that stuff. I managed to dig itself out of the NCS Masaya blessing/curse; some great gimmicks or cinemas but shallow/junky.

The Saturn one, Valken 2 (no fucked up US name this time) does a lot more than Valken 1 (Cybernator) but it isn't better. All the stuff they added just makes it feel like there is too much crap to handle going on and, personally, I never really feel in control of things. Its also made of those horribly dated pre-rendered sprites that have aged so badly. Its good, but just not as tight as Valken 1.

[soop]

You know what, I've got both, but I haven't put decent time into either for many years.  I re-aquired Ranger X last year after selling it when it was fairly current, but despite fond memories, I found it a tad confusing.  Also, I was out and about with the Nomad, and I don't think it's one of those games that translates well to portable play.

[Joe Redifer]

I played the Saturn Assaults Suits 2 and the graphics looked really blocky to me even though there was no scaling going on.

[SignOfZeta]

There's tons of scaling going on.

[VenomMacbeth]

Wait...Are we talking about Leynos 2, or Valken 2??

[SignOfZeta]

Leynos. My bad.

[Joe Redifer]

No, the background never zoomed in or out but was teh blocky. Looked like ass.

[Tatsujin]

Valken on the sfc is by far the best mech game on consoles between 8 and 32-bits.
Everything was done just the very right way.
The heavyness
The controlls
The style
The graphics (except the blocky explosions of le boss)
And even the musics and fx are great.
So it can be considered as a perfect sfc/snes game.
(Who thougt that this ever could exist?)

[SignOfZeta]

No, the background never zoomed in or out but was teh blocky. Looked like ass.

Did you play it for more than 10 seconds? I ask because...that game zooms like a mofo at times.

[Joe Redifer]

I didn't get past the first level but it was definitely more than a few minutes. What I didn't like is that the backgrounds started out blocky right away. Looks like ass. It really does, it can't be denied.

[VenomMacbeth]

Valken on the sfc is by far the best mech game on consoles between 8 and 32-bits.
Everything was done just the very right way.
The heavyness
The controlls
The style
The graphics (except the blocky explosions of le boss)
And even the musics and fx are great.
So it can be considered as a perfect sfc/snes game.
(Who thougt that this ever could exist?) 

I would have agreed with you on this if you'd said it before I discovered Wolf Fang

[CrackTiger]

Valken on the sfc is by far the best mech game on consoles between 8 and 32-bits.
Everything was done just the very right way.
The heavyness
The controlls
The style
The graphics (except the blocky explosions of le boss)
And even the musics and fx are great.
So it can be considered as a perfect sfc/snes game.
(Who thougt that this ever could exist?)   

I would have agreed with you on this if you'd said it before I discovered Wolf Fang

Isn't Wolf Fang more of an arcade version of Veigus than a perfectly balanced mech experience?

[Joe Redifer]

Wolf Fang is Vapor Trail, isn't it?

[SignOfZeta]

I thought Wolf Fang was a mediocre shooter where you could aim your ship in a fucked up way.

[Tatsujin]

Wolf Fang is Vapor Trail, isn't it?

No, Vapor Trail is "Vapor Trail" aka "Kuuga - Operation Code Vapor Trail" whereas Wolf Fang aka "Rohga: Armor Force" aka "Wolf Fang: Kuuga 2001" seems to be its sequel, though they are, look and play completely different aka they are completely different games.

[termis]

Cybernator is fricken awesome, and definitely the best game of its kind.

Target Earth is okay too - I recall people complaining straight away how difficult it was, but I did beat the thing, so I must've been one bad mofo back in the dayz (never played it again).

AS Valken 2 is good stuff too, but yeah, it just isn't as slick as Cybernator/Leynos, and I agree that it hasn't aged as well.

Blood Gear is also awesome, definitely one the gems of PCE, but not quite Cybernator good.

Ranger X... I never understood.  I really did try liking this game (considering I I liked ALL the games mentioned above) but I just never saw the appeal.  After about 2 levels, I just get bored & turn it off.

[majors]

... but I did beat the thing, so I must've been one bad mofo back in the dayz (never played it again).

Or you just hit start on the player 2 controller.

[VenomMacbeth]

Say all you will against Wolf Fang, but for me, it's the pinnacle of mech games next to Cybernator & one of my favorite games of all time.  So, I'm a bit biased.

[SignOfZeta]

Don't you fly a jet in Wolf Fang?

EDIT: Nevermind. I've been thinking of Skull Fang, aparently.

[Joe Redifer]

Yeah Skull Fang. That's what I was thinking as well.